Pleural effusion management

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Rock_Robster
Posts: 1017
Joined: Thu Oct 25, 2018 5:27 am
Location: Brisbane, Australia

Pleural effusion management

Postby Rock_Robster » Sat Feb 03, 2024 4:32 am

So last scan results were pretty good, albeit a bit hard to interpret as the radiologist reported against the wrong comparison scan which meant an extra month off-treatment was included at the start of the interval. So we need to get that fixed. But overall, nothing too threatening at present and the onc is very encouraged by the 50% CEA and CA19.9 drop over just 2 cycles of the new lighter FOLFIRI-Bev regimen.

One thing however - the chest CT showed a moderate-sized pleural effusion in the right lung. Onc isn’t too concerned yet and said if it started to bother me I could come in and have it drained, but for now is asymptomatic. My question is whether there’s anything else I can/should be doing for this - I haven’t found a lot of complementary treatment for pleural effusion specifically beyond the usual exercise, diet, etc?

Thanks,
Rob
41M Australia
2018 Dx RC
G2 EMVI LVI, 4 liver mets
pT3N1aM1a Stage IVa MSS NRAS G13R
CEA 14>2>32>16>19>30>140>70
11/18 FOLFOX
3/19 Liver resection
5/19 Pelvic IMRT
7/19 ULAR
8/19 Liver met
8/19 FOLFOX, FOLFOXIRI, FOLFIRI
12/19 Liver resection
NED 2 years
11/21 Liver met, PALN, lung nodules
3/22 PVE, lymphadenectomy, liver SBRT
10/22 PALN SBRT
11/22 Liver mets, peri nodule. Xeloda+Bev
4/23 XELIRI+Bev
9/23 ATRIUM trial
12/23 Modified FOLFIRI+Bev

Pagola44
Posts: 316
Joined: Mon Jul 03, 2023 7:57 pm

Re: Pleural effusion management

Postby Pagola44 » Sun Feb 04, 2024 6:08 am

Gosh, Wish I could contribute (especially after all the help you've provided for me), But i just don't know enough ... I did a bit of research and tried to find something but everything just seems to what you already know , diet, exercise, breathing exercises, also read acupuncture could help if symptoms present
Anyway, hope you had a good weekend Rob, keep us updated on your journey all the best
29m Male.
DX: CC, Right Hepatic Flexure, 4cm, T3, G2, M0
Stage III3B , Positive lymph nodes: (2/20)
Baseline CEA value: 1.98
LVI and PNI: absent
Surgical margins: clear
No lynch Syndrome or MSI
Primary surgery type: Laparascopic

Rock_Robster
Posts: 1017
Joined: Thu Oct 25, 2018 5:27 am
Location: Brisbane, Australia

Re: Pleural effusion management

Postby Rock_Robster » Sun Feb 04, 2024 8:51 pm

Pagola44 wrote:Gosh, Wish I could contribute (especially after all the help you've provided for me), But i just don't know enough ... I did a bit of research and tried to find something but everything just seems to what you already know , diet, exercise, breathing exercises, also read acupuncture could help if symptoms present
Anyway, hope you had a good weekend Rob, keep us updated on your journey all the best

All good and thanks mate - appreciate the research and kind words! All going well here otherwise - hope your treatment is being kind on you too.
41M Australia
2018 Dx RC
G2 EMVI LVI, 4 liver mets
pT3N1aM1a Stage IVa MSS NRAS G13R
CEA 14>2>32>16>19>30>140>70
11/18 FOLFOX
3/19 Liver resection
5/19 Pelvic IMRT
7/19 ULAR
8/19 Liver met
8/19 FOLFOX, FOLFOXIRI, FOLFIRI
12/19 Liver resection
NED 2 years
11/21 Liver met, PALN, lung nodules
3/22 PVE, lymphadenectomy, liver SBRT
10/22 PALN SBRT
11/22 Liver mets, peri nodule. Xeloda+Bev
4/23 XELIRI+Bev
9/23 ATRIUM trial
12/23 Modified FOLFIRI+Bev

rp1954
Posts: 1848
Joined: Mon Jun 13, 2011 1:13 am

Re: Pleural effusion management

Postby rp1954 » Mon Feb 05, 2024 10:12 pm

I can't add any of our specific experience directly on effusions with various possible products in the fluid.
My view of natural ingredients would differentiate those effects supportive of metabolism and immune function, and those that dented the cancer cells or pathways.
If you could review your MCV history vis a vis chemo treatments' initial MCV, maxima, minima, and finals, it might be helpful for you now.

Rock_Robster wrote:[Dec 07, 2023]...after nearly a MONTH of screening) as my LDH was too high...
I actually don’t know what my final result was - getting that sent to me now. I had been off the IV [vitamin] C for a while as I was going through the screening, but I understand this can reduce LDH so will get back on it and see if I can reduce it (either for this trial or the next one…)

So where are you now, 0-1-2 IVC per week at 1.x gram/kg? I am aware of a few case histories for plural effusions for other cancers usefully treated with IV vitamin C.
I would expect IV C to possibly impact both cancer and support, although you might be fluid or rate limited. IV vitamin C has been used as both diuretic and (additional) cancer adjuvant. My wife directly attacked LDH, inflammation markers, HIF-1a, histamine, VEGF-A, CA199 and AFP with higher doses of IV C in addition to her daily chemo (along with megavitamin K2, B6, others). Post surgery, she did IV C daily (surgery 1 - 21 days - bah! too many sticks; and surgery #2 for 10 days).
When her met load was worst, she did up to 5x/week to suppress some symptoms and markers, often at high rates.

Likewise megavitamin D3 has been used successfully in extreme unction for various cancer cases - "our" UCSF trained endocrinologist reported successes with doses of 50,000 iu/day, up to 100,000 iu/day in terminal cancer cases; other drs have used even higher amounts as a treatment. [Used medically supervised or carefully with added magnesium and K2, and calcium (less), phosphorus (less) for control]. Published/shared chemo experience with megavitamin D3 is thinner and more complicated but my wife used 25,000 - 45,000 iu/day for years on daily 5FU etc with 4-6 week calcium data. As chemo severity rises, it may make control of calcium and phosphorus levels more slightly more difficult (i.e. data more frequent) or even limiting, but even that might be a good thing - during my wife's first year she had used a megavitamin K2 bone supplement that also contained a lot of calcium (during 17,000+ iu D3/day) where her borderline high levels of calcium calcified a 6 mm "thingie" in her lung - whatever it was (she also had had ca 25-30,000 iu/day with less calcium added and lower calcium levels during this year).
watchful, active researcher and caregiver for stage IVb/c CC. surgeries 4/10 sigmoid etc & 5/11 para-aortic LN cluster; 8 yrs immuno-Chemo for mCRC; now no chemo
most of 2010 Life Extension recommendations and possibilities + more, some (much) higher, peaking ~2011-12, taper chemo to almost nothing mid 2018, IV C-->2021. Now supplements


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