Immunoscore Predicts Metastasis, Survival

Please feel free to read, share your thoughts, your stories and connect with others!
User avatar
vilca11
Posts: 730
Joined: Fri Feb 14, 2014 11:19 am
Location: Moscow, Russia; Baltimore, USA 1992; Vilcabamba, Ecuador 2012

Immunoscore Predicts Metastasis, Survival

Postby vilca11 » Tue Mar 08, 2016 5:28 pm

11/2005 CC stage 1, F,50yo@dx
Mod dif adenocar, MSS, APC, TP53, CEAs1.6-4.8
1/12 1met liver@Vena Cava, RFA, 3oxi,11 5FU
8/13 2 mets same place,SBRT
4/14 2 Xeliri+Avastin
5/14 Nano Knife liver same 2 mets
6/14 2 Xeliri, ADAPT
4/15 PET, 2 same mets,Cryo Liver
5/15 MJ Oil, Herbs, Suppl, ADAPT
10/15 PET, same area, doubled in size, high SUV
10/15 RH, HAI, visceral involv., no LN
2/16 red FF, 50% red dose FUDR, CEA trends up
3/16 CT, PET, MRI L.Lobe all in small tumors
4/16 No acceptable options, going home

mariane
Posts: 704
Joined: Sun Sep 13, 2015 6:16 pm

Re: Immunoscore Predicts Metastasis, Survival

Postby mariane » Tue Mar 08, 2016 7:17 pm

Stella, is it the article you mentioned in your message?

Interestingly I have this FBXW7 mutation mentioned. Unfortunately it did not save me from liver mets. Anyway I love to hear that it boosts immunology! Yeah!
My pathology report said: rare atypical cells with profound treatment effect in a background of inflammation, fibrosis and mucin pools. My primary resected pre chemo was ulcerating.

I messed up with my immunology a year before my diagnosis taking steroids to suppress endometriosis to get pregnant. Endometriosis itself suppresses immunology.

Interestingly my dad who had huge tumor which caused blockage and his surgeons were not too positive is 5 years NED, very active at 78. He took just 12 cycles of Xeloda , cheating during last 2 cycles.
mom of now 14 years old twins, dx @ 40 in 6/2015 with upper rectal cancer, 10+ liver mets, CEA 140
chemo: 8/2015 - 10/2016 - 4xFOLFIRINOX, 2xFOLFOX, 8xFOLFIRI, 10x5FU, HAI pump -12xFUDR
4 surgeries, complete pathological response
CEA<2 since 10/2015
NED since May 2016

I praise God for every day with my family!

User avatar
vilca11
Posts: 730
Joined: Fri Feb 14, 2014 11:19 am
Location: Moscow, Russia; Baltimore, USA 1992; Vilcabamba, Ecuador 2012

Re: Immunoscore Predicts Metastasis, Survival

Postby vilca11 » Tue Mar 08, 2016 10:08 pm

No, Mariane, what I mentioned to you in the pm is about absolutely different thing, I am waiting for a 4th part to come to my email box to post it here all together. This was just today's article in the MedScape....
11/2005 CC stage 1, F,50yo@dx
Mod dif adenocar, MSS, APC, TP53, CEAs1.6-4.8
1/12 1met liver@Vena Cava, RFA, 3oxi,11 5FU
8/13 2 mets same place,SBRT
4/14 2 Xeliri+Avastin
5/14 Nano Knife liver same 2 mets
6/14 2 Xeliri, ADAPT
4/15 PET, 2 same mets,Cryo Liver
5/15 MJ Oil, Herbs, Suppl, ADAPT
10/15 PET, same area, doubled in size, high SUV
10/15 RH, HAI, visceral involv., no LN
2/16 red FF, 50% red dose FUDR, CEA trends up
3/16 CT, PET, MRI L.Lobe all in small tumors
4/16 No acceptable options, going home

lpas
Posts: 1010
Joined: Wed Nov 19, 2014 11:11 pm

Re: Immunoscore Predicts Metastasis, Survival

Postby lpas » Tue Mar 08, 2016 10:55 pm

mariane wrote:Stella, is it the article you mentioned in your message?

Interestingly I have this FBXW7 mutation mentioned. Unfortunately it did not save me from liver mets. Anyway I love to hear that it boosts immunology! Yeah!
My pathology report said: rare atypical cells with profound treatment effect in a background of inflammation, fibrosis and mucin pools. My primary resected pre chemo was ulcerating.

I messed up with my immunology a year before my diagnosis taking steroids to suppress endometriosis to get pregnant. Endometriosis itself suppresses immunology.

Interestingly my dad who had huge tumor which caused blockage and his surgeons were not too positive is 5 years NED, very active at 78. He took just 12 cycles of Xeloda , cheating during last 2 cycles.


This is so interesting, Mariane. I took steroids (and IVIG) on and off from 2009-2013 to suppress immune-related infertility and pregnancy rejection (related to my endometriosis). This is the only way I was able to carry my two pregnancies. I've always felt this was a big part of the reason I got cancer, but I've never met anyone else with a similar history.
11/14 Dx sigmoid CC @ 45yo
12/14 Colectomy + hysterectomy
Stage IIIB, T3N1bM0, 2/20 nodes, MSS, G2, KRAS(A146T), TP53, SMAD4, ERBB2, CEA 1.0
2/15-7/15 XELOX & celecoxib
2/19 clean scope
11/19 clean CT
Ongoing cimetidine & other targeted supplements
Mom to a 6 & 8yo

mariane
Posts: 704
Joined: Sun Sep 13, 2015 6:16 pm

Re: Immunoscore Predicts Metastasis, Survival

Postby mariane » Tue Mar 08, 2016 10:58 pm

It is interesting for me since it mentions the mutation I have. I did not know it correlated with survival + boosted immune response.

Thank you, Stella!
mom of now 14 years old twins, dx @ 40 in 6/2015 with upper rectal cancer, 10+ liver mets, CEA 140
chemo: 8/2015 - 10/2016 - 4xFOLFIRINOX, 2xFOLFOX, 8xFOLFIRI, 10x5FU, HAI pump -12xFUDR
4 surgeries, complete pathological response
CEA<2 since 10/2015
NED since May 2016

I praise God for every day with my family!

lpas
Posts: 1010
Joined: Wed Nov 19, 2014 11:11 pm

Re: Immunoscore Predicts Metastasis, Survival

Postby lpas » Tue Mar 08, 2016 11:06 pm

Very interesting, vilca--thanks so much for posting. The naturopath I'm currently working with is very focused on immunology and strengthening faulty components of the immune system to ensure a healthy response. For example, I learned that my IL-2, IL-12 and IFN-gamma were all low. The doctor prescribed a tailored supplement regime (e.g. astragalus, cordyceps, fucoidan, etc.) to try and raise those values back to where they should be. We periodically test my immune function to see how the supplements are working and to make adjustments as necessary. He claims to have never seen a recurrence in an early stage cancer patient with a properly functioning immune system. I've been pretty impressed with his approach.
Last edited by lpas on Tue Mar 08, 2016 11:08 pm, edited 1 time in total.
11/14 Dx sigmoid CC @ 45yo
12/14 Colectomy + hysterectomy
Stage IIIB, T3N1bM0, 2/20 nodes, MSS, G2, KRAS(A146T), TP53, SMAD4, ERBB2, CEA 1.0
2/15-7/15 XELOX & celecoxib
2/19 clean scope
11/19 clean CT
Ongoing cimetidine & other targeted supplements
Mom to a 6 & 8yo

mariane
Posts: 704
Joined: Sun Sep 13, 2015 6:16 pm

Re: Immunoscore Predicts Metastasis, Survival

Postby mariane » Tue Mar 08, 2016 11:06 pm

Lpas, I associate my cancer with endometriosis. My endometriosis grew in my rectum and 10 years ago gynecologist surgeon burnt my rectum severely to remove it. I think it was most likely the reason that something even started to grow. Then I took steroids in 2008 before and when I was pregnant with my twins. Again I took steroids to get pregnant in 2014 but I failed (pregnancy). I grew beautiful fat cancer instead :) I hate endometriosis with all my heart. Endometriosis on the other hand loves me. Last week I got back my period after resection of my ovaries :) A small piece of ovary is left in my belly so I am not done with endometriosis. Not yet and I do not know what to do.
I would like to contact your naturopath if possible. After my final liver resection I hope to end chemo and I need some reasonable plan to boost my immune system.
mom of now 14 years old twins, dx @ 40 in 6/2015 with upper rectal cancer, 10+ liver mets, CEA 140
chemo: 8/2015 - 10/2016 - 4xFOLFIRINOX, 2xFOLFOX, 8xFOLFIRI, 10x5FU, HAI pump -12xFUDR
4 surgeries, complete pathological response
CEA<2 since 10/2015
NED since May 2016

I praise God for every day with my family!

User avatar
vilca11
Posts: 730
Joined: Fri Feb 14, 2014 11:19 am
Location: Moscow, Russia; Baltimore, USA 1992; Vilcabamba, Ecuador 2012

Re: Immunoscore Predicts Metastasis, Survival

Postby vilca11 » Wed Mar 09, 2016 7:11 am

Wow, lpas! Very interesting - thank you! That ND of yours sounds absolutely great! You took wonderful approach - being proactive with our gift is so important... Where is he located? Can you please pm to me and Mariane his phone # and name? Worth a trip while I am in the USA...

Mariane, endometriosis is a terrible thing, all my compassion to you... but do not forget, you have a father with CRC too... it is probably combined reasons, and you had tons of stress thru family matters and moving back and forth to USA, not speaking of having twins on your hands all that time... So, I would say - give yourself some credit, you've done everything in your power to treat your cancer in a best possible intelligent way... Just keep doing, trust Universe, have long term plans and no fears... The thing that I am going to post soon will help you with that part...

Hugs, vilca
11/2005 CC stage 1, F,50yo@dx
Mod dif adenocar, MSS, APC, TP53, CEAs1.6-4.8
1/12 1met liver@Vena Cava, RFA, 3oxi,11 5FU
8/13 2 mets same place,SBRT
4/14 2 Xeliri+Avastin
5/14 Nano Knife liver same 2 mets
6/14 2 Xeliri, ADAPT
4/15 PET, 2 same mets,Cryo Liver
5/15 MJ Oil, Herbs, Suppl, ADAPT
10/15 PET, same area, doubled in size, high SUV
10/15 RH, HAI, visceral involv., no LN
2/16 red FF, 50% red dose FUDR, CEA trends up
3/16 CT, PET, MRI L.Lobe all in small tumors
4/16 No acceptable options, going home

User avatar
ktwmn
Posts: 350
Joined: Tue Aug 02, 2011 9:41 am

Re: Immunoscore Predicts Metastasis, Survival

Postby ktwmn » Wed Mar 09, 2016 8:06 am

It is great to build up the immune system when you are NED and not on treatment. The problem is that when you are on chemotherapy the immune system cannot function properly because chemo basically destroys it. Unless i am mistaken (which is always a possibility) I don't think there is much a naturopath can do while on the poison.
Dx 7/11, Stage IIIc CC
12 txs Folfox 8/2011-2/2012
MSS, KRAS-mut G12D
NED until 3/2015, mets to liver and peritoneum
April-December 2015: 15 txs folfiri+avastin
Liver mets resolved; pelvic met remains
January-May 2016: folfox+avastin; allergic rxn to oxi
June-August 2016: 5FU+avastin
October 2016: looking into immuno trial
January 2017: maintenance chemo xeloda + avastin

User avatar
Jack&KatiesMommy
Posts: 640
Joined: Wed Dec 21, 2011 1:08 pm
Location: Columbus, OH

Re: Immunoscore Predicts Metastasis, Survival

Postby Jack&KatiesMommy » Wed Mar 09, 2016 10:06 am

This is so interesting, Mariane. I took steroids (and IVIG) on and off from 2009-2013 to suppress immune-related infertility and pregnancy rejection (related to my endometriosis). This is the only way I was able to carry my two pregnancies. I've always felt this was a big part of the reason I got cancer, but I've never met anyone else with a similar history.


Wow! I also took steroids from 2000-late 2002 as I was going through multiple IVF procedures and then ultimatley got pregnant....and "needed" the prednisone to prevent a misscarriage of the implanted embryos and ultimatley the baby. I was then back on them in 2004-2005 for two more rounds of IVF and a preganancy. I always felt that the immunosuppresant nature of the steroids may have been the cause of my cancer.

I will follow this thread with great interest.
Cynthia
Cynthia
Mommy to Jack (8) now (18) and Katie (4) now (14)
(My Most Precious Things)
Dx 8/11 Stage IV CRC (liver mets) CEA 2,600+
9/11 Folfiri 2/12: Failed Liver Resection
5/12 HAI pump/removed primary
4/13 Liver Resection
8/13-12/15 (10) RFAs lungs
5/17: Upper Left Lobe of lung resected.
02/18: 3 new lymph mets lung
05/18: Keytruda (MSS w/Intermediate TMB): NED CEA: 66.4, 39.2, 23.8, 13, 3.5 1.8, 1.0, 2.8 3.9, 5.0, 5.6, 1.5, .8,

JDinNC
Posts: 771
Joined: Fri Jul 05, 2013 9:49 pm
Location: Murphy, N.C.

Re: Immunoscore Predicts Metastasis, Survival

Postby JDinNC » Wed Mar 09, 2016 4:42 pm

I'm having blood work done this month....what tests should you take to see if your immune system is working well ?
61 y/o female @ DX...........
T3N0M1
6/13 DX- stage 4
Sigmoid colon cancer.
One met to lung
7/13 colon resection
8/13 lung resection
7/17 four years....NED
8/18 five years....NED
MELANOMA
63 y/o @ DX
6/15 stage 2a
7/15 surgery on arm
7/15 NED
4/16 recurrance
5/16 remove metastasis from back
5/16. Started immunotherapy
8/16 discontinue treatment
7/18...PET scan...NED

lpas
Posts: 1010
Joined: Wed Nov 19, 2014 11:11 pm

Re: Immunoscore Predicts Metastasis, Survival

Postby lpas » Fri Mar 11, 2016 12:49 pm

Hi everyone,

Sorry it's taken me so long to respond to this. I've been super busy over the last few days and haven't had a chance to post back.

I've had several requests for the info on my naturopath, so I thought I would just post it here for everyone to see. His name is Dr. James Belanger and his office is in the Boston area. A significant percentage of his patients are long distance and consult with him by phone, so you definitely don't need to travel there to work with him. I've posted a link below, which has contact info and some good background on his approach and philosophy. As some of you know, I also consult with Donald Yance's practice but Dr. Belanger is more focused on immunology issues and does more immune-specific testing.

http://www.lexingtonnaturalhealth.com/pages/Conditions/Cancer.html

Hope this helps someone. As I mentioned earlier, this guy has really impressed me with his research and data-driven approach. We'll see how it plays out.
11/14 Dx sigmoid CC @ 45yo
12/14 Colectomy + hysterectomy
Stage IIIB, T3N1bM0, 2/20 nodes, MSS, G2, KRAS(A146T), TP53, SMAD4, ERBB2, CEA 1.0
2/15-7/15 XELOX & celecoxib
2/19 clean scope
11/19 clean CT
Ongoing cimetidine & other targeted supplements
Mom to a 6 & 8yo

lpas
Posts: 1010
Joined: Wed Nov 19, 2014 11:11 pm

Re: Immunoscore Predicts Metastasis, Survival

Postby lpas » Fri Mar 11, 2016 1:27 pm

ktwmn wrote:It is great to build up the immune system when you are NED and not on treatment. The problem is that when you are on chemotherapy the immune system cannot function properly because chemo basically destroys it. Unless i am mistaken (which is always a possibility) I don't think there is much a naturopath can do while on the poison.


Interesting question. I didn't start working with this practice until after my chemo had ended, but I know Dr. Belanger works with many patients on active chemo. His website says the following:

    "In his experience, patients in remission often remain in remission when the growth factor tests and immune system tests remain normal and patients with radiological evidence of cancer, stabilize or have some if not, complete regression...Dr. Belanger is not opposed to conventional medicines and works frequently with oncologists in Massachusetts , Connecticut and New Hampshire . He feels that conventional medicines have their place, but also recognizes their limitations. Various targeted drugs, for example, such as avastin or erbitux, are very effective at blocking certain cancer growth factors, but they do not address the large variety of growth factors utilized by cancer cells. Natural medicines combined with targeting therapies can address a larger variety of growth factors and immune imbalances for a more complete and comprehensive effect. Chemotherapy and radiation kill cancer cells directly, but cancer cells often gain resistance. Natural medicines in addition to chemotherapy and/or radiation, can prevent many resistance mechanisms from being acquired."

Speaking only for myself, I've always assumed that the reason regular exercise is so beneficial for cancer patients (including those on chemo) is because of the way it stimulates the immune system. Anecdotally, our very own Brownbagger seems like a perfect example of this phenomenon. Does all that bike riding explain why he's continued to do so well on chemo over the course of seven years? I guess none of us can say for sure but it seems to me like more than just coincidence. I'm betting it's had a positive impact on his immune function despite the chemo.

http://well.blogs.nytimes.com/2009/10/14/phys-ed-does-exercise-boost-immunity/
11/14 Dx sigmoid CC @ 45yo
12/14 Colectomy + hysterectomy
Stage IIIB, T3N1bM0, 2/20 nodes, MSS, G2, KRAS(A146T), TP53, SMAD4, ERBB2, CEA 1.0
2/15-7/15 XELOX & celecoxib
2/19 clean scope
11/19 clean CT
Ongoing cimetidine & other targeted supplements
Mom to a 6 & 8yo

User avatar
ktwmn
Posts: 350
Joined: Tue Aug 02, 2011 9:41 am

Re: Immunoscore Predicts Metastasis, Survival

Postby ktwmn » Fri Mar 11, 2016 1:55 pm

Thanks, lpas. This is very helpful.

I have also been keeping up my schedule at the gym (yoga 3x/week; walking/jogging/swimming as the weather improves!) and continue to work full time. I think the physical activity has helped me tolerate strong chemo (Since last April: 15txs folfiri + avastin; and now (re) started up with folfox + avastin). Brownbagger is my hero because he seems to keep a rigorous exercise routine and is able to tolerate massive amts of chemo! I'm hoping I can get my wbcs back on track. I will investigate the ND option.
Dx 7/11, Stage IIIc CC
12 txs Folfox 8/2011-2/2012
MSS, KRAS-mut G12D
NED until 3/2015, mets to liver and peritoneum
April-December 2015: 15 txs folfiri+avastin
Liver mets resolved; pelvic met remains
January-May 2016: folfox+avastin; allergic rxn to oxi
June-August 2016: 5FU+avastin
October 2016: looking into immuno trial
January 2017: maintenance chemo xeloda + avastin

lpas
Posts: 1010
Joined: Wed Nov 19, 2014 11:11 pm

Re: Immunoscore Predicts Metastasis, Survival

Postby lpas » Fri Mar 11, 2016 2:06 pm

JDinNC wrote:I'm having blood work done this month....what tests should you take to see if your immune system is working well ?


A few of the immune tests I've had are available at LabCorp (e.g. serum IL-6, IL-8 and IL-10) but it seems like the most important and useful stuff has to be done elsewhere, at a specialized lab. I've had those tests (i.e. NK cell function, stimulated cytokine analysis, T-cell activation, etc.) done through a lab called Pharmasan that's in Wisconsin. I have to have someone draw my blood and then I mail it in a test kit to Wisconsin. It does require a doctor's order though. FYI, my insurance has covered everything my NDs order through LabCorp. I know some patients also get the Pharmasan stuff covered although I haven't had luck in that regard.

Some of the other things we test regularly are growth factors and clotting factors (e.g. VEGF, TGF-beta, fibrinogen, d-dimer, etc.). These can all be drawn through LabCorp.

FYI, here are a few other (non-immune) things we look at:

1 – Complete blood count (CBC) – look for low white or red blood cells, low hemoglobin, low platelets, low B12, elevated ferritin (ideal is to be low normal). Also watch the neutrophil to lymphocyte ratio. A persistently high ratio may be a marker of background inflammation and is considered a poor prognostic indicator in many cancers.
2 – Blood chemistry (CMP) – look for low or high glucose, low protein, low albumin, high creatinine, elevated AST, ALT, lactate dehydrogenase (LDH) or alkaline phosphatase (ALP) –Elevated blood glucose lead to elevated insulin-like growth factor 1 and this feeds cancer growth cycles. Adjust glycemic balance as needed through the diet. Low albumin or low total protein indicates a need for more dietary intake. Chlorella can also assist in raising albumin levels. ALT and AST are markers of liver stress (use milk thistle, NAC, etc. to reduce this). Alkaline phosphatase rises when there is excessive bone metabolism (metastases) and in liver metastases.
3 – Copper, zinc and ceruloplasmin – copper feeds angiogenesis. Ideal is to be in the lowest 20% of normal. Ceruloplasmin is stored copper (use cilantro, NAC and molybdenum to chelate it out of the tissues, zinc to compete for binding and absorption).
11/14 Dx sigmoid CC @ 45yo
12/14 Colectomy + hysterectomy
Stage IIIB, T3N1bM0, 2/20 nodes, MSS, G2, KRAS(A146T), TP53, SMAD4, ERBB2, CEA 1.0
2/15-7/15 XELOX & celecoxib
2/19 clean scope
11/19 clean CT
Ongoing cimetidine & other targeted supplements
Mom to a 6 & 8yo


Return to “Colon Talk - Colon cancer (colorectal cancer) support forum”



Who is online

Users browsing this forum: No registered users and 115 guests

cron