Cause of colon cancer discovered

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NHMike
Posts: 1365
Joined: Fri Jul 21, 2017 3:43 am

Re: Cause of colon cancer discovered

Postby NHMike » Fri Feb 09, 2018 5:32 pm

Absolutely amazing science.
6/23/17: ER rectal bleeding; Colonoscopy
7/13: Stage 3B rectal. T3N1bM0. 5.2 x 4.5 x 4.3 cm. Lymphs: 6 x 4 mm, 8 x 6, 5 x 5
7/31-9/8: Xeloda 3,400 mg/day+radiation
7/5: CEA 2.7; 8/16: 1.9; 9/8: 1.8; 11/30: 0.6; 12/20 1.4; 1/10 1.8; 1/31 2.2; 2/28 2.6; 4/10 2.8
MSS, KRAS G12D
10/6: 2.7 x 2.2 x 1.6 cm (-90%). Lymphs: 3 x 3 mm (-62.5%), 4 x 3 (-75%), 5 x 3 (-40%). 5.1 CM from AV
10/30: LAR, Temp Ileostomy, Path Complete Response
12/20: Started CapeOx

mpbser
Posts: 393
Joined: Wed Apr 19, 2017 11:52 am

Re: Cause of colon cancer discovered

Postby mpbser » Sun Feb 11, 2018 7:00 am

This makes sense since it's been known for a while that a healthy gut microbiome prevents cancer.
Wife 4/17 Dx age 45
5/17 - Lap left hemi
Adenocarcinoma
5 x 4 x 1 cm
low grade
T3 N2b M1a
Stage IV A
lymph nodes: 9 of 54
8/17 Sub-total colectomy
2nd tumor 5.5 cm T1 N0
CEA: 1.4, 2.1, 1.5, 1.9, 1.9, 2.1, 2.1, 2.4, 1.7, 2.0
MSS/MSI-L
Lynch no; KRAS wild
Immunohistochemsistry: Normal MLH1, MSH2, MSH6, and PMS2
Tumor DNA variants: MTOR, APC, TP53
Liver left hepatectomy seg 4 1/31/18

Utwo
Posts: 196
Joined: Mon May 23, 2016 10:14 am
Location: T.O.

Re: Cause of colon cancer discovered

Postby Utwo » Sun Feb 11, 2018 10:41 am

They have a nice theory. However we need more work to prove it.

Anyway, you need to remember that "correlation doesn't mean causation".
58 yo male at diagnosis - T1bN0, 0/15 lymph nodes, low grade/moderately differentiated adenocarcinoma
03/2016 colonoscopy #1: 2 small polyps removed in left colon; CEA = 1.3
04/2016 colonoscopy #2: caecum sessile 3.5 cm polyp piecemeal removed with kind of clear margins
05/2016 CT scan, blood test ...
05/2016 "prophylactic" laparoscopic right hemicolectomy with a few complications (bleeding, leak, infection)
06/2017 CT scan (lower body), colonoscopy OK; CEA = 1.6

NHMike
Posts: 1365
Joined: Fri Jul 21, 2017 3:43 am

Re: Cause of colon cancer discovered

Postby NHMike » Sun Feb 11, 2018 10:46 am

Reminds me of the discovery of H. Pylori.
6/23/17: ER rectal bleeding; Colonoscopy
7/13: Stage 3B rectal. T3N1bM0. 5.2 x 4.5 x 4.3 cm. Lymphs: 6 x 4 mm, 8 x 6, 5 x 5
7/31-9/8: Xeloda 3,400 mg/day+radiation
7/5: CEA 2.7; 8/16: 1.9; 9/8: 1.8; 11/30: 0.6; 12/20 1.4; 1/10 1.8; 1/31 2.2; 2/28 2.6; 4/10 2.8
MSS, KRAS G12D
10/6: 2.7 x 2.2 x 1.6 cm (-90%). Lymphs: 3 x 3 mm (-62.5%), 4 x 3 (-75%), 5 x 3 (-40%). 5.1 CM from AV
10/30: LAR, Temp Ileostomy, Path Complete Response
12/20: Started CapeOx

User avatar
CRguy
Posts: 9515
Joined: Sun Feb 10, 2008 6:00 pm

Re: Cause of colon cancer discovered

Postby CRguy » Sun Feb 11, 2018 11:14 pm

NOT trying to be the wet rag here,
thrown on the embers of new hope ...... BUTT

the reference is from a 2015 study with a theory ... yada yada yada
= I am not buying in right now and .... I really don't follow anything on MSN channels

IF something shows up in the reviewed science journal feeds I may get excited
OR , I may not ... BECAUSE
both these "bacteria" are normal commensal inhabitants of human GITs

Utwo already posted : "correlation doesn't mean causation"

WORD !

I will always keep an open mind ...
just NOT so open my brain falls out ! :shock:

NOT trying to be obstreperous
just being me ... BUTT always enjoy the chance to exchange opinions and views with homies here

Cheers all
CR

being grumpy :twisted:
Caregiver x 3
Stage IV A rectal cancer/lung met
11 Year survivor
my life is an ongoing totally randomized UNcontrolled experiment with N=1 !
Review of my Journey so far

User avatar
Atoq
Posts: 233
Joined: Wed Oct 25, 2017 9:31 am

Re: Cause of colon cancer discovered

Postby Atoq » Mon Feb 12, 2018 7:14 am

It is very complicated to analyse this type of data, I am myself trying to analyse a dataset on intestinal microbiome in lundehund. Microbes in the guts affect each other and are affected by diet, age, immunsystem, genetics. Who is affecting who? Microbiome is also modulating immune response and affecting our brain. There are even papers showing how microbiome correlates with aging. It is indeed a promising field :D

Best

Claudia
45 year old, mother of 2
Dx rectal cancer October 2017
At least T3N2aMX (suspect metastasis to one lung 8 mm)
Lynch negative
Neoadjuvant chemoradiotherapy Xeloda + 25x2 Gy
05.12.17 laparotomic surgery for blockage, colostomy
25.01.18 laparotomic lar, hysterectomy, ileostomy
05.03.18 core needle biopsy of lung, updated to stage IV
07.05.18 CAT scan, lung metastasis 11 mm
04.06.18 ileostomy reversal
26.06.18 VATS surgery scheduled

Rikimaroo
Posts: 125
Joined: Tue Dec 20, 2016 8:48 pm

Re: Cause of colon cancer discovered

Postby Rikimaroo » Mon Feb 12, 2018 10:36 am

For Colo rectal Cancer, I think its mainly what you eat and how your lifestyle is in regarding movement. If you sit all day and don't get up to allow blood circulation, or eat a lot of red meat, and drink a lot of alcohol I think this contributes more heavily then this study.

Most docs I know have said high consumption, especially grilling open fire of meats increases the carcinogenic activities in the meats. Plus sitting down all day doesn't help either LOL...
Diagnosed at 38 y/o male, 3 kids 7,9,14 - Now 39.
RC T3N1M0
Chemo Rad, CCR - W&W 5/2017
Local Recurrence, discuss options 11/26/2017
CT Scan 11/2017 Liver Met 5.5cm Stable, Stage IV
Port Scheduled for 12/15/2017, folfox/oxapalatin + avastin starts on the 12/20/2017
Blood Clot in Neck 1/16/2018, stop avastin, continue FolFox
TME/Liver Resect 4/3/2018
Biopsy Results 0/8 Lymph nodes clear, margins not clear, CEA now .8, more chemo and possible radiation, outlook looks good, staying positive!!

NHMike
Posts: 1365
Joined: Fri Jul 21, 2017 3:43 am

Re: Cause of colon cancer discovered

Postby NHMike » Mon Feb 12, 2018 11:38 am

Rikimaroo wrote:For Colo rectal Cancer, I think its mainly what you eat and how your lifestyle is in regarding movement. If you sit all day and don't get up to allow blood circulation, or eat a lot of red meat, and drink a lot of alcohol I think this contributes more heavily then this study.

Most docs I know have said high consumption, especially grilling open fire of meats increases the carcinogenic activities in the meats. Plus sitting down all day doesn't help either LOL...


I know people that are highly active that have had CRC and know those that are sedentary that have it.

Video of me playing tennis for 50 minutes on the next to last day of Chemo and Radiation:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R_ipaq4HTk0&t=1284s

I ran over 40 miles the week before I was diagnosed, and, except for the tumor, felt fantastic. I do sit when I work but I get up a lot for quick trips to the gym for little workouts. The Adjuvant chemo has killed a lot of that but I'm eager to get back to getting in shape, running, playing tennis, doing weights, yoga and pilates.
6/23/17: ER rectal bleeding; Colonoscopy
7/13: Stage 3B rectal. T3N1bM0. 5.2 x 4.5 x 4.3 cm. Lymphs: 6 x 4 mm, 8 x 6, 5 x 5
7/31-9/8: Xeloda 3,400 mg/day+radiation
7/5: CEA 2.7; 8/16: 1.9; 9/8: 1.8; 11/30: 0.6; 12/20 1.4; 1/10 1.8; 1/31 2.2; 2/28 2.6; 4/10 2.8
MSS, KRAS G12D
10/6: 2.7 x 2.2 x 1.6 cm (-90%). Lymphs: 3 x 3 mm (-62.5%), 4 x 3 (-75%), 5 x 3 (-40%). 5.1 CM from AV
10/30: LAR, Temp Ileostomy, Path Complete Response
12/20: Started CapeOx

Rikimaroo
Posts: 125
Joined: Tue Dec 20, 2016 8:48 pm

Re: Cause of colon cancer discovered

Postby Rikimaroo » Mon Feb 12, 2018 11:45 am

i agree with you NHmike. It can happen to anyone no matter. But they have linked colorectal cancer to mainly what you eat and your lifestyle. I mean cancer can happen to a perfectly healthy person. Do I hate that red meat is linked to it or alcohol or sedentary sure...but it is what it is.

NHMike let me ask you did you eat alot of deli meats, steak, sausage, hot dogs, bacon (pork)?
Diagnosed at 38 y/o male, 3 kids 7,9,14 - Now 39.
RC T3N1M0
Chemo Rad, CCR - W&W 5/2017
Local Recurrence, discuss options 11/26/2017
CT Scan 11/2017 Liver Met 5.5cm Stable, Stage IV
Port Scheduled for 12/15/2017, folfox/oxapalatin + avastin starts on the 12/20/2017
Blood Clot in Neck 1/16/2018, stop avastin, continue FolFox
TME/Liver Resect 4/3/2018
Biopsy Results 0/8 Lymph nodes clear, margins not clear, CEA now .8, more chemo and possible radiation, outlook looks good, staying positive!!

User avatar
Atoq
Posts: 233
Joined: Wed Oct 25, 2017 9:31 am

Re: Cause of colon cancer discovered

Postby Atoq » Mon Feb 12, 2018 12:17 pm

Anyway, by adding genetics, lifestyle and diet as factors you will only find an increase in probability to get colon cancer when you have a large statistical sample.

So from a single person it is very difficult to extrapolate.

One can be very active, eating healthy and skinny, but might just got a casual mutation (error in DNA duplication) that went undetected, or maybe ate too many veggies or fruit coming from polluted areas.

There are so many unknown factors that can be summarized as «bad luck». Of course meat, diary products and sugar are not helping.

Claudia
45 year old, mother of 2
Dx rectal cancer October 2017
At least T3N2aMX (suspect metastasis to one lung 8 mm)
Lynch negative
Neoadjuvant chemoradiotherapy Xeloda + 25x2 Gy
05.12.17 laparotomic surgery for blockage, colostomy
25.01.18 laparotomic lar, hysterectomy, ileostomy
05.03.18 core needle biopsy of lung, updated to stage IV
07.05.18 CAT scan, lung metastasis 11 mm
04.06.18 ileostomy reversal
26.06.18 VATS surgery scheduled

NHMike
Posts: 1365
Joined: Fri Jul 21, 2017 3:43 am

Re: Cause of colon cancer discovered

Postby NHMike » Mon Feb 12, 2018 12:27 pm

Rikimaroo wrote:i agree with you NHmike. It can happen to anyone no matter. But they have linked colorectal cancer to mainly what you eat and your lifestyle. I mean cancer can happen to a perfectly healthy person. Do I hate that red meat is linked to it or alcohol or sedentary sure...but it is what it is.

NHMike let me ask you did you eat alot of deli meats, steak, sausage, hot dogs, bacon (pork)?


I do not eat pork or shellfish.

I had changed my diet 10 years ago to reduce red meat but not completely eliminate it.
6/23/17: ER rectal bleeding; Colonoscopy
7/13: Stage 3B rectal. T3N1bM0. 5.2 x 4.5 x 4.3 cm. Lymphs: 6 x 4 mm, 8 x 6, 5 x 5
7/31-9/8: Xeloda 3,400 mg/day+radiation
7/5: CEA 2.7; 8/16: 1.9; 9/8: 1.8; 11/30: 0.6; 12/20 1.4; 1/10 1.8; 1/31 2.2; 2/28 2.6; 4/10 2.8
MSS, KRAS G12D
10/6: 2.7 x 2.2 x 1.6 cm (-90%). Lymphs: 3 x 3 mm (-62.5%), 4 x 3 (-75%), 5 x 3 (-40%). 5.1 CM from AV
10/30: LAR, Temp Ileostomy, Path Complete Response
12/20: Started CapeOx

NHMike
Posts: 1365
Joined: Fri Jul 21, 2017 3:43 am

Re: Cause of colon cancer discovered

Postby NHMike » Mon Feb 12, 2018 12:31 pm

Atoq wrote:Anyway, by adding genetics, lifestyle and diet as factors you will only find an increase in probability to get colon cancer when you have a large statistical sample.

So from a single person it is very difficult to extrapolate.

One can be very active, eating healthy and skinny, but might just got a casual mutation (error in DNA duplication) that went undetected, or maybe ate too many veggies or fruit coming from polluted areas.

There are so many unknown factors that can be summarized as «bad luck». Of course meat, diary products and sugar are not helping.

Claudia


I read an article indicating that your odds for cancer grow exponentially as you get older because all of the cell splits can result in wider and wider mutations. It's also possible to lose some of the mutation repair stuff over time. There's also Allele protection. I did some research into Alleles for the TIL stuff and found that we get six of these things and there are hundreds of different kinds and that the Alleles that you get protect you from various diseases. So you might be more prone to various illnesses depending on what Alleles you were coded from. Immunology is fascinating stuff.
6/23/17: ER rectal bleeding; Colonoscopy
7/13: Stage 3B rectal. T3N1bM0. 5.2 x 4.5 x 4.3 cm. Lymphs: 6 x 4 mm, 8 x 6, 5 x 5
7/31-9/8: Xeloda 3,400 mg/day+radiation
7/5: CEA 2.7; 8/16: 1.9; 9/8: 1.8; 11/30: 0.6; 12/20 1.4; 1/10 1.8; 1/31 2.2; 2/28 2.6; 4/10 2.8
MSS, KRAS G12D
10/6: 2.7 x 2.2 x 1.6 cm (-90%). Lymphs: 3 x 3 mm (-62.5%), 4 x 3 (-75%), 5 x 3 (-40%). 5.1 CM from AV
10/30: LAR, Temp Ileostomy, Path Complete Response
12/20: Started CapeOx

Rikimaroo
Posts: 125
Joined: Tue Dec 20, 2016 8:48 pm

Re: Cause of colon cancer discovered

Postby Rikimaroo » Mon Feb 12, 2018 12:37 pm

The statistics to get colorectal cancer at my age 39, is very low, I think like 2.4 percent I read somewhere. It is defintely some mutation or that one month in october of 2016 where I ate sausage every day cause we had like 40 left over from a bday party for my daughter. Who knows though really. I mean that year the the year before 2015 i ate alot of red meat and stuff, and sedentary lifestyle even though I am not fat.

You just never know, I mean I think I was still active enough to not get cancer, but I wonder all the time, why me and how the hell did this happen. I know people who eat way worse then me and big around the waistline and still no issues. I mean not sure what there old age will bring but always wonder you know guys.

We will keep the good fight, I just want to survive for my kids.
Diagnosed at 38 y/o male, 3 kids 7,9,14 - Now 39.
RC T3N1M0
Chemo Rad, CCR - W&W 5/2017
Local Recurrence, discuss options 11/26/2017
CT Scan 11/2017 Liver Met 5.5cm Stable, Stage IV
Port Scheduled for 12/15/2017, folfox/oxapalatin + avastin starts on the 12/20/2017
Blood Clot in Neck 1/16/2018, stop avastin, continue FolFox
TME/Liver Resect 4/3/2018
Biopsy Results 0/8 Lymph nodes clear, margins not clear, CEA now .8, more chemo and possible radiation, outlook looks good, staying positive!!

NHMike
Posts: 1365
Joined: Fri Jul 21, 2017 3:43 am

Re: Cause of colon cancer discovered

Postby NHMike » Mon Feb 12, 2018 12:44 pm

Rikimaroo wrote:The statistics to get colorectal cancer at my age 39, is very low, I think like 2.4 percent I read somewhere. It is defintely some mutation or that one month in october of 2016 where I ate sausage every day cause we had like 40 left over from a bday party for my daughter. Who knows though really. I mean that year the the year before 2015 i ate alot of red meat and stuff, and sedentary lifestyle even though I am not fat.

You just never know, I mean I think I was still active enough to not get cancer, but I wonder all the time, why me and how the hell did this happen. I know people who eat way worse then me and big around the waistline and still no issues. I mean not sure what there old age will bring but always wonder you know guys.

We will keep the good fight, I just want to survive for my kids.


I had the flu from about November 2016 to April 2017 and I attribute my cancer to that. Might have been weakened immune system, stomach bug that introduced something bad into my digestive system or the body just not being able to cope with work and illness at the same time. But that seems to be the most obvious trigger to me for me.
6/23/17: ER rectal bleeding; Colonoscopy
7/13: Stage 3B rectal. T3N1bM0. 5.2 x 4.5 x 4.3 cm. Lymphs: 6 x 4 mm, 8 x 6, 5 x 5
7/31-9/8: Xeloda 3,400 mg/day+radiation
7/5: CEA 2.7; 8/16: 1.9; 9/8: 1.8; 11/30: 0.6; 12/20 1.4; 1/10 1.8; 1/31 2.2; 2/28 2.6; 4/10 2.8
MSS, KRAS G12D
10/6: 2.7 x 2.2 x 1.6 cm (-90%). Lymphs: 3 x 3 mm (-62.5%), 4 x 3 (-75%), 5 x 3 (-40%). 5.1 CM from AV
10/30: LAR, Temp Ileostomy, Path Complete Response
12/20: Started CapeOx


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