Scary times . . .

[JJH]

MD Anderson
https://www.mdanderson.org/patients-family/becoming-our-patient/planning-for-care/coronavirus-protections.html

MSKCC
https://www.mskcc.org/blog/2019-novel-coronavirus-covid-19-key-facts-and-what-it-means-people

UCSF experts discuss factors related to virus– 3/25/20
https://youtu.be/1xm3eq_-J3c

City of Hope
https://www.cityofhope.org/breakthroughs/covid-19-advice-for-cancer-patients-survivors-and-caregivers

The Lancet: Risk of COVID-19 for patients with cancer
https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lanonc/article/PIIS1470-2045(20)30149-2/fulltext

The Lancet: Cancer guidelines during the COVID-19 pandemic
https://www.thelancet.com/journals/lanonc/article/PIIS1470-2045%2820%2930217-5/fulltext

U.S. News and World Report: Coronavirus and cancer patients
https://health.usnews.com/conditions/articles/coronavirus-and-cancer-patients

CDC
https://www.cdc.gov/coronavirus/2019-ncov/

WHO
https://www.who.int/emergencies/diseases/novel-coronavirus-2019

European Union
https://www.ecdc.europa.eu/en/novel-coronavirus-china

[teacher49]

I'm thinking of all of you during this time. All of you still in treatment, caring for a family member in treatment, and/or coping with young children at home...AND particularly and of you who are healthcare workers.

I haven't been on this site for a long time...probably since my own health stabilized and then lost my dear husband to esophageal cancer 3 years ago.

Take care everyone.

[stu]

Lovely to hear from you teacher . Nice to see your name pop up .
Take care ,
Stu

[Lee]

Yes good to see your post teacher. Please don't be a stranger.

Okay, I just read an article on my phone, if I had it on my computer, I would link it. Let me first say, ANYBODY who is a first responder, works in the medical field, or is a cancer patient in active treatment, and maybe certain other individuals, I believe this does not apply.




---"Top Coronavirus Myths, Hoaxes and Scams".

"A face mask will protect you from COVID-19" Per the article, this is a false statement. For the general public without respiratory illness, wearing lightweight disposable surgical mask is not recommend.

"Because they don't fit tightly, they may allow tiny infected droplets to get into the nose, mouth, or eyes. Also people with the virus on their hands who touch their face under a mask might become infected," John Hopkins Medicine said in a blog post.

People with a respiratory illness can, however' wear these masks to lessen the chance of infecting others.

Certain models of professional tight-fitting respirator--such as the N95-- can protect health workers when they care for infected patients.---




I'm just throwing this out there FYI. Copied it word for word. I was looking for masks at one time a few weeks back for getting on a plane to Florida. Not now.

Lee

[Trying]

We were going to go to vegas next month as a break from my cancer but obviously cancelling. I'm so scared of my chemo treatment on friday and completely understand your worries. It is such a tough time

Nicole

[Siti]

"Because they don't fit tightly, they may allow tiny infected droplets to get into the nose, mouth, or eyes. Also people with the virus on their hands who touch their face under a mask might become infected," John Hopkins Medicine said in a blog post.

Lee

If your read the statement carefully, it’s wrong. If a person is exposed to infected droplets in the air, I strongly believe the person with a filter has a much lower chance of inhaling the droplets vs someone who is unprotected. This goes for the second statement, if their hands have virus, the mask actually stops them to be in direct contact with their face.

I think we need to use our own common sense. I do agree that masks should be prioritised to people in the front line, but lying to people to curb shortage isn’t something I agree with.

Finally, the mask also prevents people from spreading the virus as you can become a carrier without showing symptoms.

[stu]

Hi ,
Our front line staff have a special fitting of the masks around their face . Then a very smelly gas is pumped around them to see if they can smell it .
The paper ones are often not waterproof so anyone coughs on you , you have to immediately remove it and wash your face . The staff ones are waterproof. I have five just in case we get it as I think it has a role for helping to stop spreading it within a household .

Things are chaos here . Seeing what people are made off . Some lovely , some selfish.
Take care ,
Stu
.

[jsbsf]

Our hospital seems to be on top of things. They won’t allow anyone but patients into the building. They spaced the chairs about 8 feet apart. In the waiting room, someone will immediately thoroughly disinfect the chair after someone is called in. The only nurses who are allowed to come close are those who must. There is no small talk. Even when we go for a blood test, I (caregiver) have to wait in the car. This is San Francisco Kaiser. They do unfortunately have a shortage of face masks.

[stu]

Hospitals have worked hard in some areas . Sounds a good set up . Like all that cleaning .
My friend is a district nurse and won’t be treating actively ill patients but I am giving her two of my masks . Not the proper ones but if someone starts a good old coughing session she can pop one on and head straight out the door .
Take care ,
Stu

[Lee]

"Because they don't fit tightly, they may allow tiny infected droplets to get into the nose, mouth, or eyes. Also people with the virus on their hands who touch their face under a mask might become infected," John Hopkins Medicine said in a blog post.

Lee

If your read the statement carefully, it’s wrong. If a person is exposed to infected droplets in the air, I strongly believe the person with a filter has a much lower chance of inhaling the droplets vs someone who is unprotected. This goes for the second statement, if their hands have virus, the mask actually stops them to be in direct contact with their face.

I think we need to use our own common sense. I do agree that masks should be prioritised to people in the front line, but lying to people to curb shortage isn’t something I agree with.

Finally, the mask also prevents people from spreading the virus as you can become a carrier without showing symptoms.

I hope you are wrong, butt my gut feeling says you are probably very correct. I pray we can get rid of this virus sooner rather than later. Would love to kick it into the next universe.


Lee

[Lee]

Stu, you are good person.

Lee

[CRguy]

Without being my usual curmudgeonly self ...
there are questionable statements in this topic AND I will try not to be a jerk addressing them

IF you are not infected and walking around at a proper "social distancing" distance
( which I have renamed "anti-social" distancing !! ) a mask is not really needed

Unless you have a proper type of mask and it is FITTED PROPERLY >>> most are not ...
wearing a mask as a preventive measure is NOT effective.

Effective masks MUST be conserved for front line workers and first responders ...
not the majority of effing morons we see walking around our cities right now ... and sadly a lot of the time anyway where I live

Mask or no mask ... unless you have an airtight seal around the whole face INCLUDING EYES !!!!!
you have NOT protected all susceptible mucous membranes which are entry points for pathogens.
( I have done an asbestos remediation and HAVE a full face respirator head shield with a complete seal ...
they are annoying, uncomfortable and a pain in the ass )

Properly fitted EFFECTIVE masks protect health care workers within the critical distance when they are attending to actively infected patients,
AND to prevent the caregiver from exposing the compromised patient to other pathogens !

Using a mask on the street to do whatever the hell you think it will do ....
DOES NOT do anything to protect your own health any more than hoarding toilet paper at home !!!!

Seriously folks
let's give our heads a shake and trust the western science

follow the FIVE * and stay alive
... safe and sane

JMO your mileage may vary
CRguy


[[ the FIVE *
1. social distancing of 6 feet
2. wash your hands properly with soap for 20 seconds or use an effective hand sanitizer
3. AVOID SICK folks and large crowds !!!
4. don't touch your face/mouth/nose/eyes
5. if you are sick STAY HOME, call the doctor and self isolate ]]

[stu]

I actually have not seen many masks around here but to be honest , but I think at least they are acting in some way .
We still have whole sections of society that are not taking any measures and think it’s hype !
Still grouping and spreading .
I get there is a lot of mixed messages around the science . One week we are told herd immunity , get to the Rugby. The next week the same officials say the science indicates otherwise. It’s been sufficient in sending out very mixed messages making the public rightly think they don’t know much at all . Then they refuse to comply .

I have acted in ways I can have a clear conscience with . I would hate to infect someone due to my lack of due care and that I find stressful . Knowing what best to do .

It’s a mind field right now to digest it all .

Take care ,
Stu

[Siti]

I fully agree with Stu. As a caregiver, I feel that I need to be responsible if the general public is still taking it easy and meeting up in groups. If it wasn’t for my husband’s diagnosis, I would be willing to sacrifice myself for the benefit of “herd immunity” so that I can contribute in protecting the weak.

My best friend, an accomplished doctor, whom I trust and also chosen by Singapore to represent her country, has advised that it’s necessary to wear a mask, especially in the hospital. Yes it may not be as effective as a well fitted N95 mask, but does help filter out large droplets and shield accidental hand to face contact. The mask also works both ways, reduces the spread of virus. In China during the full lockdown, elected individuals of a household aren’t not allowed to leave their home without a mask. So to your point about trusting western medicine, let the numbers speak for itself.

Anyway on the news today, it has come to the point that in The Netherlands, the cancer hospitals are now accepting infected patients and compromising cancer care. The doctors here are also faced with ethical decisions. I don’t believe the so called “social distancing” works.

Here’s something to ponder on:

https://www.theguardian.com/society/202 ... -decisions

[roadrunner]

Re: Masks — It is certainly interesting that we all watched news videos of nearly *everyone* in Asian countries wearing masks (including China’s Xi — and if that doesn’t tell you something, well . . .), few in Western Europe doing the same, and now marvel at how the Asian countries contained the virus while we (and the EU) can’t. I also was somewhat puzzled by the proliferating news stories in the US media on this, in which the usual advice was “masks don’t work, and we need to save them for healthcare workers.” Where I come from, you can have one or the other, (media) folks, but not both. I worry that Western negativity toward masks is to some extent cultural, may reflect Western hubris, and in some cases is a social control mechanism because we were so much more underprepared than the Asian countries (we simply don’t have enough masks, even for health care workers).

I completely respect opinions to the contrary, and mean no disrespect to anyone, but my common sense/educated guess is that masks, even ordinary surgical masks, are not by any means *foolproof*, but likely provide *some* protection against infection, especially if fitted well and well-handled. If true, that would matter across a society in limiting spread, but *may* also matter in an individual case by reducing/blocking inhaled/exhaled viral load/particles. It’s potentially marginal, but probably there. As a cancer patient, am I not asked to massively impact my health through chemo for an 8% survival benefit? And it will be interesting to see if the “advice” changes if the mask supply ever catches up.

Re: “Social distancing doesn’t work.” I disagree. Again, it may not be “foolproof” — after all, the air moves around, and viral particles can stay aloft for hours, but it *reduces risk*, especially across a population. It is also a constant reminder to be vigilant, and to take this seriously. (I have been for years careful about not touching my face, and it took me years to get even reasonably good at it.) Besides, in the US, at least, it’s all we’ve got. Again, the Asian countries have a big advantage because there are often fewer political and cultural barriers to compliance with risk reduction measures there.

For what it’s worth, if you are higher-risk, my advice would be to use whatever measures you can to protect yourself, even uncertain and/or marginal ones, as long as those don’t otherwise increase risky behavior. For most healthy people in the US and Europe right now, the right choice may be “no mask” because their risk is so low and we have critical shortages. For those of us with compromised immune systems or other cancer comorbidities, perhaps the calculus is otherwise. And social distancing? For the sake of everyone, I adhere to it as strictly as possible. It may not be perfect, but it is better than the alternative.