Any surgeons doing Laser surgery?

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stu
Posts: 901
Joined: Sat Aug 17, 2013 5:46 pm

Any surgeons doing Laser surgery?

Postby stu » Fri Dec 22, 2017 10:14 am

Hi ,
Just heard Dr Ladas has retired in the UK . Does anyone know if any other surgeon is carrying out this procedure . ?
Thanks for your help ,
Stu
supporter to my mum who lives a great life despite a difficult diagnosis
stage4 2009 significant spread to liver
2010 colon /liver resection
chemo following recurrence
73% of liver removed
enjoying life treatment free
2016 lung resection
Oct 2017 nice clear scan . Two lung nodules disappeared
Oct 2018. Another clear scan .

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peanut_8
Posts: 2315
Joined: Sun May 25, 2014 1:31 pm
Location: Capital of Texas

Re: Any surgeons doing Laser surgery?

Postby peanut_8 » Fri Dec 22, 2017 4:26 pm

Hi Stu,

I remembered that our dear member Sophy had the procedure done somewhere in Germany.

In this thread, viewtopic.php?f=1&t=52487&p=411935&hilit, I found this info...

"There are a few hospitals in Germany which do this procedure. I was operated on in the one in Coswig by Professor Rolle. If you do a google search you will find their current phone number etc. "

Hope your Mom is doing well.
Best Wishes,
peanut


edit
I did a little more research, and found that Dr. Rolle is also retired. Dr. Drewes is now taking his place.
http://www.cureasps.org/forum/viewtopic.php?t=1227
Terri aka peanut
diagnosed Jan 14, RC stage 2a, age 56
permanent colostomy
MSS
April 14, 28 chemo/rad with Xeloda
June 14 adjuvant Xeloda 6 rounds
currently NED

stu
Posts: 901
Joined: Sat Aug 17, 2013 5:46 pm

Re: Any surgeons doing Laser surgery?

Postby stu » Fri Dec 22, 2017 5:08 pm

Oh thank you Peanut . That is most helpful . It’s for another patient .
Mum is doing great if not a little tired as she transforms into Mrs Claus this time of year giving to far and wide . She scanned well and seems to still be keeping well . She could be doing with resting a little but I doubt that will actually happen .
It’s a special day here as my son is 18 . Never thought back in 2009 his gran would be part of it .
I wish you a very Merry Christmas . We have been having beautiful frosty days here . Scotland suits the frost .
Thank you once again ,
Stu
supporter to my mum who lives a great life despite a difficult diagnosis
stage4 2009 significant spread to liver
2010 colon /liver resection
chemo following recurrence
73% of liver removed
enjoying life treatment free
2016 lung resection
Oct 2017 nice clear scan . Two lung nodules disappeared
Oct 2018. Another clear scan .

zephyr
Posts: 142
Joined: Thu Aug 18, 2016 7:31 am

Re: Any surgeons doing Laser surgery?

Postby zephyr » Fri Mar 23, 2018 2:49 pm

Has anyone had any luck contacting the U.K. hospital and finding out who has taken over for Dr. Ladas? They haven't responded to my email and my Google searches are turning up nothing. I have written to Dr. Drewes in Germany but I would like also to get information from the U.K.

Thanks in advance for any help.
Nov-2009 Early stage CRC found during routine colonoscopy
2010, 2011, 2014 Follow up colonoscopies, all clear
Jun-2016 CRC found during routine follow up colonoscopy, surgery, Stage 4, KRAS, inoperable lung mets
Aug-2016-May-2018 Folfox, 5FU & Avastin, 5FU, Folfiri & Cyramza
Aug/Sep-2018 YAG laser surgeries (Germany) on both lungs, 11 nodules (9 mets) removed

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Sophy
Posts: 250
Joined: Fri May 27, 2011 2:46 am
Location: New Zealand

Re: Any surgeons doing Laser surgery?

Postby Sophy » Sun Mar 25, 2018 12:23 am

Zephyr - I found it best to phone instead of email, the number is +44 20 3553 2620, his secretary Justine is very helpful. I was very impressed by Ladas, I think he did a great job and is kindly as well. I would also recommend phoning Coswig instead of emailing, if you or a friend speak German that would help.

The surgery in Germany is the same and costs less. However, it could be more difficult for you as most staff there do not speak any English. They are used to foreign patients and accommodate them well. The patient stays two weeks in the hospital and an accompanying person can share the room and have all meals. Or if you prefer or more than one person accompanies then they have rooms with their own bathrooms and a shared kitchen in a building next door which can be hired for a very low cost. In London I stayed in the hospital for three nights then had to find my own accommodation for the next two weeks, luckily I have relatives in the UK.

There are many posts about the lung laser surgery by CB75 and Mastan who sadly have died. Stevieb who is doing well has also posted about his experiences so you could look at their posts for additional info.

Hope this helps
Sophy
dx T3N1M0 Feb 11 when children age 11, 7 and 2
Xeloda/rad March 11, LAR June 11 temp ileo
Xelox 6 rounds, NED
Lung mets Oct 13
Laser surgery Germany Jan 14. 3 mets left lung.
Laser surgery UK Jun and Aug 14 one met each lung, NED
Aug 14 Started Xeloda and Celebrex (ADAPT)
Oct 2018 CT shows still NED
Continuing ADAPT

zephyr
Posts: 142
Joined: Thu Aug 18, 2016 7:31 am

Re: Any surgeons doing Laser surgery?

Postby zephyr » Mon Mar 26, 2018 9:17 am

Sophy wrote:Zephyr - I found it best to phone instead of email, the number is +44 20 3553 2620, his secretary Justine is very helpful. I was very impressed by Ladas, I think he did a great job and is kindly as well. I would also recommend phoning Coswig instead of emailing, if you or a friend speak German that would help.

The surgery in Germany is the same and costs less. However, it could be more difficult for you as most staff there do not speak any English. They are used to foreign patients and accommodate them well. The patient stays two weeks in the hospital and an accompanying person can share the room and have all meals. Or if you prefer or more than one person accompanies then they have rooms with their own bathrooms and a shared kitchen in a building next door which can be hired for a very low cost. In London I stayed in the hospital for three nights then had to find my own accommodation for the next two weeks, luckily I have relatives in the UK.

There are many posts about the lung laser surgery by CB75 and Mastan who sadly have died. Stevieb who is doing well has also posted about his experiences so you could look at their posts for additional info.

Hope this helps
Sophy


Thanks so much, Sophy! I'm on it.
Nov-2009 Early stage CRC found during routine colonoscopy
2010, 2011, 2014 Follow up colonoscopies, all clear
Jun-2016 CRC found during routine follow up colonoscopy, surgery, Stage 4, KRAS, inoperable lung mets
Aug-2016-May-2018 Folfox, 5FU & Avastin, 5FU, Folfiri & Cyramza
Aug/Sep-2018 YAG laser surgeries (Germany) on both lungs, 11 nodules (9 mets) removed

tigerpaw
Posts: 57
Joined: Sat Jun 20, 2015 1:34 pm
Facebook Username: kristin.lossius
Location: Norway

Re: Any surgeons doing Laser surgery?

Postby tigerpaw » Wed Mar 28, 2018 1:36 pm

Actually many thoracic surgeons have laser equipment and can do the procedure. But I think many are reluctant because they do not believe removing many lung mets with laser improves long term prognosis. So it is no a question of technology, but of the usage.
63y female
dx July 13 resection of primary in sigmoid colon
Stage 3B cc, T3N1M0
KRAS mutant, codon 12/13, MSS
FLOX (FLV infusion 2 consecutive days + oxi) August 2013. Oxi stopped after 8tx
clear CT 6/14
peri mets + lung met 12/14
1/15 HIPEC
3/15 Lung resection
8/15 Subcutaneous met in midline abdomen-resected
8/15 Two lung nodules, observation, no chemo
2/17 enlarged lymph nodes hilus and mediastinum
5-8/17 FLV + Avastin
3/18 radiation to mediastinal and hilar lymph nodes

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Sophy
Posts: 250
Joined: Fri May 27, 2011 2:46 am
Location: New Zealand

Re: Any surgeons doing Laser surgery?

Postby Sophy » Thu Mar 29, 2018 5:40 am

That is interesting to hear about laser treatment, Tigerpaw. When I spoke with Professor Rolle he told me that he had developed his laser himself because it is just at the right frequency for lung tissue - to cauterise and cut withour damage to surrounding lung tissue.

I have not heard of another laser being used for lung surgery. Usually surgery it is done with a scalpel requiring 3 or more cm margins around a met or suspected met. The lung laser only needs 1 or 2 mm margins which is why up to 100 mets can be removed using it instead of 4 or 5 mets with traditional surgery. The DFS from lung laser surgery is also over 25% over 5 years which is very much better than the traditional 5%.

This forum is a great place to hear about different treatments and different outcomes from all around the world and we are both very lucky that we can learn from many people who have been diagnosed before us.

Kind regards
Sophy
dx T3N1M0 Feb 11 when children age 11, 7 and 2
Xeloda/rad March 11, LAR June 11 temp ileo
Xelox 6 rounds, NED
Lung mets Oct 13
Laser surgery Germany Jan 14. 3 mets left lung.
Laser surgery UK Jun and Aug 14 one met each lung, NED
Aug 14 Started Xeloda and Celebrex (ADAPT)
Oct 2018 CT shows still NED
Continuing ADAPT

tigerpaw
Posts: 57
Joined: Sat Jun 20, 2015 1:34 pm
Facebook Username: kristin.lossius
Location: Norway

Re: Any surgeons doing Laser surgery?

Postby tigerpaw » Fri Mar 30, 2018 12:15 pm

I asked my thoracic surgeon in Norway and I also spoke to an oncologist in Heidelberg, Germany who had been working in the Thoracic surgery department. They both confirmed having the equipment and using it primarily on lung cancer. It is the wavelength of the laser beam I think is crucial. I got the impression the equipment is rather widespread.
63y female
dx July 13 resection of primary in sigmoid colon
Stage 3B cc, T3N1M0
KRAS mutant, codon 12/13, MSS
FLOX (FLV infusion 2 consecutive days + oxi) August 2013. Oxi stopped after 8tx
clear CT 6/14
peri mets + lung met 12/14
1/15 HIPEC
3/15 Lung resection
8/15 Subcutaneous met in midline abdomen-resected
8/15 Two lung nodules, observation, no chemo
2/17 enlarged lymph nodes hilus and mediastinum
5-8/17 FLV + Avastin
3/18 radiation to mediastinal and hilar lymph nodes

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Sophy
Posts: 250
Joined: Fri May 27, 2011 2:46 am
Location: New Zealand

Re: Any surgeons doing Laser surgery?

Postby Sophy » Sat Apr 07, 2018 3:13 am

From my research back in 2013 the lung laser is widely used in German hospitals with much success but it seems to be very little known of in other countries. From what members here have said there is one machine in Canada and the one in London which was used in my surgery, otherwise it is a German procedure.

This seems a shame as the laser does have a good result for patients with lung only mets. I asked Dr Ladas in London why he won't operate on patients with additional mets elsewhere and he replied that the surge in growth hormones repairing damage from surgery also caused the other mets to grow more quickly.

I have heard that Dr Ladas has now retired so it would be great to be able to share where the surgery is currently available if anyone knows? I am rather out of touch with my most recent lung laser surgery being over 3 1/2 years ago and I have been NED since. :D
dx T3N1M0 Feb 11 when children age 11, 7 and 2
Xeloda/rad March 11, LAR June 11 temp ileo
Xelox 6 rounds, NED
Lung mets Oct 13
Laser surgery Germany Jan 14. 3 mets left lung.
Laser surgery UK Jun and Aug 14 one met each lung, NED
Aug 14 Started Xeloda and Celebrex (ADAPT)
Oct 2018 CT shows still NED
Continuing ADAPT

zephyr
Posts: 142
Joined: Thu Aug 18, 2016 7:31 am

Re: Any surgeons doing Laser surgery?

Postby zephyr » Sat Apr 07, 2018 10:04 am

First, a BIG thanks to Sophy for continuing to provide information.

I'm pursuing the Germany option. Since Dr. Rolle and Dr. Ladas have both retired, I felt more comfortable going to Germany because it's my understanding that Dr. Drewes, the thoracic surgeon in Germany, assisted Dr. Rolle on many surgeries and has his endorsement. I don't speak German ... but there's an app for that. Everything is on hold until we have the results of the CT scan next week and Dr. Drewes is able to review it. I also have heard that the laser is available in Canada and while that would certainly be the simplest option, I feel more confident going to where the laser was developed and the surgeon has years of experience with this surgery. That said, if anyone knows of a surgeon in Canada with a lot of experience doing this surgery, I sure hope they will chime in.
Nov-2009 Early stage CRC found during routine colonoscopy
2010, 2011, 2014 Follow up colonoscopies, all clear
Jun-2016 CRC found during routine follow up colonoscopy, surgery, Stage 4, KRAS, inoperable lung mets
Aug-2016-May-2018 Folfox, 5FU & Avastin, 5FU, Folfiri & Cyramza
Aug/Sep-2018 YAG laser surgeries (Germany) on both lungs, 11 nodules (9 mets) removed

zephyr
Posts: 142
Joined: Thu Aug 18, 2016 7:31 am

Re: Any surgeons doing Laser surgery?

Postby zephyr » Sat May 26, 2018 3:50 pm

For anyone thinking about this surgery and needing more current information to show their doctor(s), here is a 2018 review of surgical procedures/papers, including the Rolle laser:

http://jtd.amegroups.com/article/view/21448

If you click the PDF link on the right, it will take you to a page where you can download the whole article. If you have problems, feel free to PM me with your email address and I'll send you a pdf copy of mine.
Nov-2009 Early stage CRC found during routine colonoscopy
2010, 2011, 2014 Follow up colonoscopies, all clear
Jun-2016 CRC found during routine follow up colonoscopy, surgery, Stage 4, KRAS, inoperable lung mets
Aug-2016-May-2018 Folfox, 5FU & Avastin, 5FU, Folfiri & Cyramza
Aug/Sep-2018 YAG laser surgeries (Germany) on both lungs, 11 nodules (9 mets) removed

zephyr
Posts: 142
Joined: Thu Aug 18, 2016 7:31 am

Re: Any surgeons doing Laser surgery?

Postby zephyr » Wed Aug 22, 2018 10:57 am

I am currently in Coswig, Germany, recovering from surgery on my right lung. Dr. Drewes was ill so Dr. Kern did my surgery. He’s terrific.

My mets were considered inoperable in the States, both because of number and the location of two central mets deep in the lungs.

My right lung was cleared of 8 nodules: 1 was scar tissue of sorts (possibly a met wiped out by chemo), 2 were benign, and 5 were active metastases. The lymph nodes were clear. I did lose my right middle lobe because one met had grown too large to resect without damaging airways and such.

I’m one week out from surgery. Would I do it again? YOU BET! Sure, there have been some tough periods but overall I have no complaints. The people here are so kind, so patient, so caring. The communication barrier has been a problem at times but manageable.

The plan now is for me to return home, have a few rounds of chemo to shrink one particular nodule on the left side - another deep central one - so that it can be removed without damaging other stuff, and then return for surgery on my left lung.

I hope something in this post will benefit someone else. If anyone would like more info, please feel free to PM me. I’ll get back to you as soon as I can.
Nov-2009 Early stage CRC found during routine colonoscopy
2010, 2011, 2014 Follow up colonoscopies, all clear
Jun-2016 CRC found during routine follow up colonoscopy, surgery, Stage 4, KRAS, inoperable lung mets
Aug-2016-May-2018 Folfox, 5FU & Avastin, 5FU, Folfiri & Cyramza
Aug/Sep-2018 YAG laser surgeries (Germany) on both lungs, 11 nodules (9 mets) removed

AJ787
Posts: 2
Joined: Sat Jul 28, 2018 5:01 pm
Facebook Username: Angela Johnson

Re: Any surgeons doing Laser surgery?

Postby AJ787 » Fri Sep 21, 2018 4:10 pm

Hey zephyr, good to hear your news sounds really positive, it’s a long way to go but as you say worth it. My OH has multiple mets so I’m interested in the place in Germany you mention (we live in UK). I know each case is different but could you give a rough figure in cost please. Wishing you a good recovery and long lasting good health.

zephyr
Posts: 142
Joined: Thu Aug 18, 2016 7:31 am

Re: Any surgeons doing Laser surgery?

Postby zephyr » Mon Sep 24, 2018 10:52 am

AJ787 wrote:Hey zephyr, good to hear your news sounds really positive, it’s a long way to go but as you say worth it. My OH has multiple mets so I’m interested in the place in Germany you mention (we live in UK). I know each case is different but could you give a rough figure in cost please. Wishing you a good recovery and long lasting good health.


Hi AJ787. Assuming there are no complications, plan on about €15,000 per surgery. That includes all testing, the surgery, and your hospital stay (room, meds, meals, etc). In my case there were complications, along with some genetic testing outside the hospital, and a guest room for a family member, and my bill was a little over €18,000.

As it happens, the genetic testing on my nodules showed the same mutations. There were so many questions - could we find a new chemo?, could I tolerate it?, would the cancer spread in the interim?, etc. - that we decided to stay in Germany, skip chemo, and just go forward with the second surgery. I will almost certainly lose the upper left lobe but all indications are that after I recover, I’ll probably not miss it much. I’ll never qualify for the Boston Marathon or climb Mt. Everest, but those experiences probably weren’t going to happen anyway. I check back into the hospital tomorrow and assuming the cancer hasn’t spread (please, please, please), the next surgery will be later this week.

If you have any other questions, don’t hesitate to PM or post. I’ll answer when I can.
Nov-2009 Early stage CRC found during routine colonoscopy
2010, 2011, 2014 Follow up colonoscopies, all clear
Jun-2016 CRC found during routine follow up colonoscopy, surgery, Stage 4, KRAS, inoperable lung mets
Aug-2016-May-2018 Folfox, 5FU & Avastin, 5FU, Folfiri & Cyramza
Aug/Sep-2018 YAG laser surgeries (Germany) on both lungs, 11 nodules (9 mets) removed


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