Life Insurance Accelerated Death Benefit Rider

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JDMNYC
Posts: 133
Joined: Wed Apr 15, 2015 5:12 pm
Location: Morris County, New Jersey

Life Insurance Accelerated Death Benefit Rider

Postby JDMNYC » Fri Oct 21, 2016 7:03 pm

Not to be maudlin, but does anyone have any experience with a Stage IV diagnosis triggering the ability to use an Accelerated Death Benefit rider on a life policy? In the case of my policy, the rider allows payment of 50% of face value of policy (up to a limit) on provision of a written statement from my doctor that life expectancy is one year or less (two years in states I don't live in).

Anyone used this? How was interaction with doctor? How was interaction with insurer?

Not looking to die within a year, but wouldn't mind doing a little planning and gathering some information.

Thanks.
Last edited by JDMNYC on Sat Oct 22, 2016 8:22 am, edited 1 time in total.
- Dx Stage IIIc rectal cancer: January 2015 (CEA 20)
- Chemo (Folfox): January - April 2015
- Chemo-Radiation (Xeloda): May - June 2015
- Surgery (LAR/temporary ileostomy): September 2015; 4/20 lymph nodes – no adjuvant chemo
- Reversal: December 2015
- Stage IV: August 2016 - Lung Mets
- Chemo (Xeloda) Started October 2016.
- CEA down; lung mets shrinking.

"There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio, Than are dreamt of in your philosophy."

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CRguy
Posts: 10285
Joined: Sun Feb 10, 2008 6:00 pm

Re: Life Insurance Accelerated Death Benefit Rider

Postby CRguy » Fri Oct 21, 2016 11:07 pm

You have chanelled into the EXACT reason " Critical Illness Insurance " was born.

Back in the day (my day :shock: ) when HIV /AIDS was considered a death sentence ... the MegaInsuros figured out that it was easier and cheaper to pay out 50% up front on a life insurance policy, than 100% of what they would have had to pay later....Geez what wonderful humanitarians .... :twisted: :twisted: :twisted:

I have not had to "dance with these devils" for THIS reason ... BUTT I would have a well versed INDEPENDENT Insurance agent/broker on my team, and a savvy lawyer on speed dial.

JMO .... YMMV

Cheers and best wishes
CRguy
Caregiver x 4
Stage IV A rectal cancer/lung met
14 Year survivor
my life is an ongoing totally randomized UNcontrolled experiment with N=1 !
Review of my Journey so far

JDMNYC
Posts: 133
Joined: Wed Apr 15, 2015 5:12 pm
Location: Morris County, New Jersey

Re: Life Insurance Accelerated Death Benefit Rider

Postby JDMNYC » Sat Oct 22, 2016 8:29 am

CRguy wrote:You have chanelled into the EXACT reason " Critical Illness Insurance " was born.

Back in the day (my day :shock: ) when HIV /AIDS was considered a death sentence ... the MegaInsuros figured out that it was easier and cheaper to pay out 50% up front on a life insurance policy, than 100% of what they would have had to pay later....Geez what wonderful humanitarians .... :twisted: :twisted: :twisted:

I have not had to "dance with these devils" for THIS reason ... BUTT I would have a well versed INDEPENDENT Insurance agent/broker on my team, and a savvy lawyer on speed dial.

JMO .... YMMV

Cheers and best wishes
CRguy


Thank you CRguy - good advice for sure. I think in my case that the policy simply nets the accelerated benefit from the face value, and pays the remainder after death. I'd need to pay a year's interest on the accelerated benefit (they treat it like a loan, I guess :)).

I'm confused about where to get the "life expectancy" numbers by year for Stage IV though - I've seen all the stuff about five years being 12%, but do you have any idea where the numbers might be for 1 year, 2 years, 3 years, etc.?

Thanks.
- Dx Stage IIIc rectal cancer: January 2015 (CEA 20)
- Chemo (Folfox): January - April 2015
- Chemo-Radiation (Xeloda): May - June 2015
- Surgery (LAR/temporary ileostomy): September 2015; 4/20 lymph nodes – no adjuvant chemo
- Reversal: December 2015
- Stage IV: August 2016 - Lung Mets
- Chemo (Xeloda) Started October 2016.
- CEA down; lung mets shrinking.

"There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio, Than are dreamt of in your philosophy."

crazylife
Posts: 255
Joined: Wed Dec 30, 2015 11:29 am

Re: Life Insurance Accelerated Death Benefit Rider

Postby crazylife » Sat Oct 22, 2016 8:39 am

I believe there is a pretty strict clause that states death must be expected within one year. Luckily I don't think you are there with a few lung nodules. I think you can take a loan against it though. We have a whole life policy and can borrow against it.
Wife to DH, 41 years old, diagnosed 11/15
Stage 4, Mod diff, 13/24 LN, 1 liver met
Colon/liver resection at MSK, 11/15
8mm lung met (not confirmed) and enlarged lymph nodes 1/16
12 rounds of folfox (9 with Oxi) 6/16
NED - July 2016
NED - October 2016
3 lung mets - March 2017
7 lung mets, May 2017
RFA to largest met, June 2017
Lung mets growing slowly, October 2017 (off treatment since June 2016)
Right lung surgery, November 2017
Left lung surgery, January 2018
NED - May 2018

JDMNYC
Posts: 133
Joined: Wed Apr 15, 2015 5:12 pm
Location: Morris County, New Jersey

Re: Life Insurance Accelerated Death Benefit Rider

Postby JDMNYC » Sat Oct 22, 2016 9:24 am

I agree, I don't think I'm there (I don't even like writing "yet") either, but having reviewed the language, it appears to require a certification w/r/t to life expectancy, rather than an analysis of the individual case.

I'd just be curious to find the expectancy numbers for metastatic rectal cancer by year, which I can't seem to find anywhere. Unfortunately, this is a term policy, so no loans are possible.
- Dx Stage IIIc rectal cancer: January 2015 (CEA 20)
- Chemo (Folfox): January - April 2015
- Chemo-Radiation (Xeloda): May - June 2015
- Surgery (LAR/temporary ileostomy): September 2015; 4/20 lymph nodes – no adjuvant chemo
- Reversal: December 2015
- Stage IV: August 2016 - Lung Mets
- Chemo (Xeloda) Started October 2016.
- CEA down; lung mets shrinking.

"There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio, Than are dreamt of in your philosophy."

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mypinkheaven
Posts: 459
Joined: Fri May 20, 2016 4:29 pm
Facebook Username: Sally Cunningham
Contact:

Re: Life Insurance Accelerated Death Benefit Rider

Postby mypinkheaven » Sat Oct 22, 2016 12:31 pm

JDMNYC wrote:
I'm confused about where to get the "life expectancy" numbers by year for Stage IV though - I've seen all the stuff about five years being 12%, but do you have any idea where the numbers might be for 1 year, 2 years, 3 years, etc.?

Thanks.


Here are two calculators that give percentages for different years:

http://www3.mdanderson.org/app/medcalc/ ... ctumcancer

http://skynet.ohsu.edu/nomograms/gastro ... rectal.php
MSS, KRAS Wild NRAS Mutated
9/2012 CRC IIB Lft Colectomy 0 lymph nodes 0 Chemo
10/2013 CT clear
11/15 CEA 2.7 to 4.6
11/15 Spread to uterus. Hysterectomy
2/16 Pelvic radiation 25, brachytherapy 3
4/16 - 6/16 Xeloda
6/16 CT Several lung nodules 5 mm
8/16 CT Nodules still present. Most stable. Some growth
11/16 Transfer to UCSD Moores
12/16 Folfox + Avastin failed
2/17 Folfiri + Erbitux
8/17 5FU+Erbitux No 5FU bolus
7/18 Spread to vagina
6/18 Folfiri + Avastin + Trametinib
6/18 CEA dropping

jhocno197
Posts: 817
Joined: Mon May 11, 2015 9:33 pm

Re: Life Insurance Accelerated Death Benefit Rider

Postby jhocno197 » Sat Oct 22, 2016 9:47 pm

Here's one for each year up to five (click colon cancer & keep scrolling)

http://www.cancercenter.com/colorectal- ... tatistics/
DH - dx Dec 2014, stage IV with bladder & peritoneal involvement - non-resectable
Colostomy
FOLFOX failed
FOLFIRI failed
Tumor actually distending pelvic skin
Not a candidate for last-ditch pelvic exenteration
Stivarga finally begun 2/19/16
Tumor growing/fungating
Lonsurf started 11/18/16
Died 3/10/17

DBF
Posts: 323
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Location: New York

Re: Life Insurance Accelerated Death Benefit Rider

Postby DBF » Tue Oct 25, 2016 1:39 pm

I did a viatical settlement with one of my term policies. If you'd like to discuss it feel free to PM me. I had a letter from my onc that outlined life expectancy in a general way. If I outlive the term, I'm going to have a big party. :wink:
6/13 Dx @ 29 Wks pregnant, 42 yo
Adenocarcinoma, mucinous
7/13 C-sec/col resec/part. hysterectomy
8/13 Pulm embolism
8/13 Spread to liver
9/13 Liver resection
FOLFOX
CEA UP
ADAPT: Xeloda/Celebrex
2/14 oopherectomy
10/15 obstruction surg
10/17 Scar tissue removal/vsg surg
2019: NED :D
2020: NED
Mom to 3 boys: 22, 11 & 7

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Bev G
Posts: 5856
Joined: Thu Jan 07, 2010 11:19 pm
Facebook Username: Bev Golde
Location: Quechee, VT

Re: Life Insurance Accelerated Death Benefit Rider

Postby Bev G » Wed Oct 26, 2016 9:37 pm

When my husband was diagnosed with lymphoma and failed all of the standard chemo protocols, I looked into the accelerated death benefit on his policy. Ultimately, our oncologist submitted a letter to the insurance company stating that she believed he had 6-12 months to live. They payed out 50% of the face value of policy (maybe it was 75%---I can't remember) If my husband succumbed in less than a year, the remainder of the policy would have been paid out. If he survived more than a year, the balance of the policy would be forfeited. So, our oncologist was willing to write the letter (interestingly, the lymphoma oncologist was NOT). We moved from our home in Pittsburgh to Vermont where there was the possibility of a bone marrow transplant to try to cure the lymphoma. Ultimately he had a successful transplant done about 2.5 years ago, and may be cured. There is no residual llfe insurance, and no possibility to get it. So thankful about the way it worked out! Best wishes to you.
58 yo Type1 DM 48 years
12/09 Stage IV 2/22 nodes + liver met, colon resec
3 tx FOLFIRI, liver resec 4/10
9/10 6 mos off chemo, Neg PET&CTC CEA nl
2/11 finished total 10 rounds chemo

9/13 ^17th clean PET/CT NED for now

JDMNYC
Posts: 133
Joined: Wed Apr 15, 2015 5:12 pm
Location: Morris County, New Jersey

Re: Life Insurance Accelerated Death Benefit Rider

Postby JDMNYC » Wed Oct 26, 2016 9:41 pm

Thanks Bev -

That's a pretty good way to have it work out, I'd say :)

Jim
- Dx Stage IIIc rectal cancer: January 2015 (CEA 20)
- Chemo (Folfox): January - April 2015
- Chemo-Radiation (Xeloda): May - June 2015
- Surgery (LAR/temporary ileostomy): September 2015; 4/20 lymph nodes – no adjuvant chemo
- Reversal: December 2015
- Stage IV: August 2016 - Lung Mets
- Chemo (Xeloda) Started October 2016.
- CEA down; lung mets shrinking.

"There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio, Than are dreamt of in your philosophy."

JDMNYC
Posts: 133
Joined: Wed Apr 15, 2015 5:12 pm
Location: Morris County, New Jersey

Re: Life Insurance Accelerated Death Benefit Rider

Postby JDMNYC » Wed Oct 26, 2016 9:43 pm

Thank you jhocno197 - Appreciate it.

Jim
- Dx Stage IIIc rectal cancer: January 2015 (CEA 20)
- Chemo (Folfox): January - April 2015
- Chemo-Radiation (Xeloda): May - June 2015
- Surgery (LAR/temporary ileostomy): September 2015; 4/20 lymph nodes – no adjuvant chemo
- Reversal: December 2015
- Stage IV: August 2016 - Lung Mets
- Chemo (Xeloda) Started October 2016.
- CEA down; lung mets shrinking.

"There are more things in heaven and earth, Horatio, Than are dreamt of in your philosophy."

Robinf
Posts: 31
Joined: Sun Jan 25, 2015 2:36 am
Location: WA

Re: Life Insurance Accelerated Death Benefit Rider

Postby Robinf » Tue Nov 01, 2016 3:23 am

I had an accelerated death benefit on my insurance and took advantage of it last year. Each policy can and will be different on all kinds of deails, meaning how much they pay out, life expectancy required for payout etc.

The terms of my policy was that they would payout 50% of my life insurance amount up to 500k. The remainder would be paid at my death. I had to be diagnosed with a terminal illness, with a life expectancy of 24 months.

From a process standpoint, it was easy peasy - fill out a form that includes a physician statement where my onc checked the box that said my prognosis was terminal and my life expectancy was less than 24 months (which based on stage 4 prognosis was reasonable). For my policy, there are no penalties if I live longer than expected, meaning I dont have to pay anything back, the remainder of my insurance isn't forfeited, I don't owe interext on anything, etc. if I dont die in the 24 month period.

For me, it was a win win scenario.

Happy to talk more, so PM if you'd like. Like I said though, each policy is different so my experience is not necessarily indicative of anything other tham my experience.
Dx stage 4 Sept 2014 (MSS, KRAS Mutant)
Resection with peri mets identified visually during surgery
Nothing visible on CT
12 rounds FOLFOX w/ Avastin Nov - Apr 2015
Still nothing visible on CTs
HIPEC May 2015
7/2015 - 5 new spots on CT, PET confirmed 3 mets
8/12/15-Begin 12 rounds FOLFIRI
10/21/15 Scan - peri mets stable, 1 liver stable and 1 growing
12/4/15 - RFA of liver met
2/24/16 - scan was stable/shrinking moving to Xeloda/Avastin


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