Anyone using non-toxic alternatives?

[DonnaO]

Hello,

I have Stage 4 colon cancer that has mets to my bones in two places (rib that grew into my lung and sacrum).

I have had one week of radiation in December and completed two treatments of chemo before saying enough.

I just joined this forum this AM and I am looking to contact people who are using non-toxic alternatives to treat their cancer.

I stopped Essiac Tea on Thursday and will start Protocel 50 tomorrow AM.

Any feedback would be appreciated.

Thank you

[vilca11]

Hi Donna,

I am using alternatives, but I will know results only in mid-March. And these results might not be attributed to alternatives only, but also to SBRT that I have done on liver in August. So, it is hard to say (if my PET shows a pretty picture) what really helped. Besides, I am planning to start my own "protocol" from April.
So, what I am doing right now is a temporary thing since I am not sure it would help with my Stage 4. I will not go into describing it, since I am changing that to a different alternative treatment. Only will tell you that it is Hoxsey, which I am very sure is a great regimen (I saw the handwritten testimonies - thousands of them - in their clinic in Mexico), but not sufficient for stage 4. I added a few things to Hoxsey protocol, and some of them will continue in April.
The main thing I wanted to tell you is what I am planning to use in my own "protocol". All of those things have a good research behind them, but, again, it is shooting into sky on my behalf , kind of. And before I start, just one more thing - be very careful with Protocel - for some people it is quite unbearable and does not help either. It also must not be combined with some other alternatives. Check on that in CancerTutor articles about Protocel.

Ok, I ordered the following supplements from LEF (Life Extension Foundation - the best quality supplements for cancer patients and they also have their own "protocol" , I did not read it though since I already had my ideas from the book of one scientist that cured his own glioblastoma with a few things, so part of my "protocol" is the stuff he was taking) Go to their web and search for the stuff below to see what they are:

PSK, Black Cumin oil with BCM95 (Bio-Curcumin), Genistein, Ubiqunol, Melatonin 20mg, Vit C with quercitine, Astragalus. Omega 3 - I made bold what the scientist was taking. The problem is that his book is in my Baltimore house and I am in Ecuador right now - so, I do not remember his name and what else he was taking, but I remember for sure that the 3 things I bolded were the main things he attributed his success to. The rest I added for myself.

To the above, I am adding from other sources: BIRM (see on Amazon - powerful immunomodulator from Dulcamara plant), Nutriferon (immunomodulation, Shaklee)) and Vivix (great antioxidant with grape, Shaklee web site), Liver Rescue 4+ (HealthForce.com), Chinese herbs that Hoxsey prescribed (you will not be able to order these, but just look for some herbal replacement that will work in a laxative way to help to get read of bad cells), Clove Oil (just any source - highest ORAC scale on Earth), Dragon's Blood and Uno de Gato (Cat's Claw) - check on Amazon, but raw things, not capsules or tablets - cook Cat's Claw yourself.

So, I combined things that kill cancer cells, things that modulate the immune system, things that cleanse the body and things that affect cellular structure to improve cell's functioning. Will see how it will work on my PET scan next fall.

I will also have MJ Oil in a month, with high CBD strain - will use it per rectum in the capsules - this is curative, not for pain. Send me a PM (the button for a private message is on the right side of the messages) if you have questions. This forum is a great place, but a very few people use alternatives, so it is not an interesting topic for others.

Hugs, Vilca

[pog451]

Donna,

I hope you google anything you take, because lots of so-called "alternative" therapies are actually highly toxic, certainly in the sort of concentrations that would be effective against cancer. Also please try and include some critical and sceptical sources rathe than just the over-enthusiastic usually self-referencing "big pharma is bad, mmmkay?" Paranoia sites.

Although no "alternative" therapy has (to date) been proved effective, many hide behind the fact that they've never been tested so MAY be effective. Interestingly, you have chosen two substances that HAVE been tested and, unfortunately, both have been shown to be totally ineffective, Protocel to such an extent that it is now illegal in the US to sell it as a cancer treatment.

Ultimately, its your choice and only you can tell if you can or cannot take any more conventional treatment, but as long as you have viable alternatives, please don't forgo them for substances like Protocel that are ultimately snake oil.

Good luck.

[vilca11]

Forgot to add to my message above. The doses of supplements for cancer pts are usually x 3 the recommended dose. I know now what doses I will be taking for the following( effective doses for the rest we both need to research and see in research papers): BIRM - 8cc x3 a day after food, Nutriferon 2 caplets x3 a day after food (both prescribed by oncologists), MJ oil slowly rise to 1gm a day at bedtime, Melatonin 20mg at bed time, Dragon's Blood 15drops x 3 a day, Clove Oil 1 drop in water x2 a day, Liver Rescue 4+ 3capsules x3 a day after food, Vivix 1 tsp a day with food.

Hugs, Vilca

[rp1954]

An intensive monitoring plan for blood markers and scans might be a good idea, especially for alternatives without any chemo to stay on track and measure changes for each step. The least chemo used here successfully might be whiteswan's accounts for stage 3C. I think that the most successful CAM reported for stage IV CRCs have been complementary uses or combined therapies.

[vilca11]

Hi Rp,

Yes, Cimetidine has good research support and must be taken by majority. But I can bet that it was PSK that helped this woman (white swan). I did take 800mg of Cimetidine at night, along with Naltrexon and ALA for half a year and had a recurrence. I think, it did not work for me because my CEAs stay in a very low range (2-4) regardless of metastases.... It usually works better for the people who have high range of CEA.

But the fact that this woman was on PSK confirms to me that I am on a right track with my upcoming "protocol". Genistein and Melatonin are also extremely important components of that "protocol". Also, vit D3 levels are very important, I brought mine up to 80....And, of course, a diet - whole organic foods, no white sugar, no commercial salt, no white flour, no white rice, no aged cheese (ah.....), no milk, no bad fats, no fried food, no commercial meats, about 50% fresh/raw, if someone can do some fasting and lots of juicing (anticancer veggies & greens, not fruits), that would help too for sure, good water (I have shungit stones - not sure of spelling - they structure bottled water and add minerals to it), trace minerals, etc.... Not very restrictive, sustainable, does not require much sacrifice .... Would be wonderful if people add exercise to it, but I hate that part and do not do it....

I am not a good example anyway - I do not do anything that would significantly interfere with my life enjoyment - that is why I do not do "heavy" conservative things - it is the quality of life that matters to me, not the years that you spend in suffering from all the medical invasions, horrified and exhausted ... When it is stage 4, I think it is reasonable to consider that kind of choice.... One thing is to do a quick SBRT or 5FU without Oxi, and another thing is to go thru repeated heavy chemos and repeated radiations - VERY hard, I have no idea how people go thru that - my heart is breaking when I read their messages... We have to be realistic - stage 4 is stage 4, very few become lucky.... And some of these few lucky ones might be as well on a carefully chosen, well supported alternatives, like the ones I listed....

I had a friend here in our Hacienda in Vilcabamba, Ecuador. She died 3 years ago. She was from Canada. She had stage 3 ovarian cancer, tried surgery and few rounds of chemo, gave up on 4th round, then just moved from Canada to our beautiful place in the Andes and lived 8 more years doing only Vit C, Vit K and various mineral IVs, plus some inconsistent diet.... All her ovarian cancer friends who did chemo, radiation, etc in Canada were dead long before her.... I think, on stage 4 our goal is to hang in until we have a good immunotherapy for CRC, and things I listed for Donna might help her to do just that....

Hugs, Vilca

[pog451]

The doses of supplements for cancer pts are usually x 3 the recommended dose.

What are you basing that statement on?

[Bob_Weiss]

Many of the "non-toxic" substances listed in the messages above would be appropriate to take during the post-treatment phase; after becoming NED or at least after becoming stable. It is not wise to substitute non-proven treatments for the standard treatments that have been shown to have clinical value in clinical trials meeting FDA standards. People may do this because they fear the symptoms or damage that treatments may cause. I had this fear myself. My solution was to choose the least toxic of the effective treatment choices available. So I chose Xeloda rather than infused 5-FU; I skipped Oxalyplatin; I refused the final two radiation sessions (although I did get 23 sessions). Most important perhaps, my oncologist took my symptoms seriously and provided many drugs and suggestions for dealing with them.

[KWT]

Bob ,
Did you ever get any info on the difference in using xeloda without oxi compared to with? I've had six rounds with oxi and two to go" I'm afraid the side effects are going to be worse these last two and would love to cut out the oxi.

[vilca11]

I wrote a very long reply to Pog about the doses - just right now - posted it and it is not there!!!!! I spent more than an hour writing it with details - where is it?? This happens to me the second time, it is very upsetting.... Can someone report it to the Board, may be they can find it in the cyber space of the forum? It has a lot of important info and I just can't write it again....
vilca

[CRguy]

I wrote a very long reply to Pog about the doses - just right now - posted it and it is not there!!!!!
......Can someone report it to the Board, may be they can find it in the cyber space of the forum? vilca

Sorry vilca I checked the moderator logs and do not see it.

Check your User Control Panel screen under Overview / manage drafts OR
Private Messages / manage PM drafts and your PM Outbox and Sent Messages .... just to be sure it is not still in any of these places.

I have also experienced this glitch over the years and sometimes the post will show up later ?????

What I do now if I am writing an involved reply, is to use a separate word processor / text editor to compose the post..... then just cut and paste into the forum post or Pm screens. That way if something happens I still have the original offline.

CRguy

[Bob_Weiss]

Bob ,
Did you ever get any info on the difference in using xeloda without oxi compared to with? I've had six rounds with oxi and two to go" I'm afraid the side effects are going to be worse these last two and would love to cut out the oxi.

I found many references to studies showing that Oxy added some modest positive value to infused 5-FU, but none for Xeloda plus Oxy. My oncologist was very familiar with Xeloda, having participated in a Xeloda research study. He had no problem with me not getting Oxy. Since he was specialized in Gastrointestinal oncology, not simply general oncology, I had a great deal of faith in his judgment. Had he insisted on Oxy, I might have taken it. Recently, I heard about a NCI clinical trial in progress about whether Oxy added to Xeloda is superior to Xeloda alone.

[vilca11]

Thanks much, CR - you are always so helpful. I checked the User panel, did not find anything... anyway, decided very briefly this time to outline my response to Pog about how do I know the doses in the alternative treatments.

I had 3 experiences of alternative treatments. One was in 2006, right after my cancer surgery and just for maintenance/preventive with a Chinese physician, who was an MD and TCM. I am not going to describe his absolutely wonderful and unique approach (he is a famous one in the US and International Health organizations), since I was then after just stage 1 surgery and do not know if his approach can help in stage 4. He was also a 30 years survivor of stage 3 lung cancer, cured by his own methods. It is my own fault that I misbehaved so very much that after 6years being NED jumped to stage 4.

So, the second one was Dr. Burt Berkson, MD, New Mexico, the pioneer of ALA treatment, right after my 5FU for the first met in liver. Dr. Berkson also worked in the 90s with late Dr. B. Bihari, MD (NY) who was a pioneer of LDN. The ALA + LDN + Vit C IV is a great protocol for autoimmune diseases, like MS and Hep C - I witnessed impossible in Dr. Berkson's office for these diseases, but with cancer it is 50/50. I know people from his clinic who are helped with cancer, but for me it did not work.

The third one was Mexican MD in Hoxsey clinic, which is a great place, but with stage 4 it is again 50/50. As I mentioned before, though, tons of testimonies in the clinic, from the people who keep coming for check ups for 20 years....

All the above physicians prescribed me a lot of supplements in addition to a major treatments. The dose was always from 2x to 4x more than the label recommends. Supplements are used by healthy people, along with the sick ones. So, for cancer patients the dose on majority of supplements is always a few times a normal dose. The exceptions might be on the things like multivitamin, or the like.... But if a supplement is used for the treatment of cancer, not a maintenance of good health, of course it is higher....

The books of people who cured themselves of cancer, like the one of a scientist I mentioned before, have the doses too. The rest is research of studies for a particular supplement. Hope I answered Pog's question, though not as elaborate as I outlined in my disappeared email.

Want to say that I do NOT recommend to anyone to START their research on alternatives - it is sooooooooo much BS there and sucking money, but there are great things too. To distinguish, you need years of reading, trying, etc. - at stage 4 we do not have time to do that. I started in 2005 my research, but still find myself confused and overwhelmed in many ways when I read about this stuff.... In addition, in order to find something that would work for that particular person, people try 6-7 types of alternative - that takes lots of time too. Only 5% of the patients survive on alternative treatment, according to what I've read a few years ago. But there is a Bio-Focus lab in Germany and labs in Greece that by your blood analysis tell you what chemo or what alternative would work better for your cancer - they check all available chemo and bunch of alternatives - Curcumin, Artemisinin, Laetril, etc... A similar US lab uses tumor tissue, so not everyone can use that lab. Also a metabolic analysis of your body would allow to conclude if you will benefit from ketogenic diet or juicing. So, let's be clear there is no one size fits all in the alternative world (same in conventional, if they would do it right, e.g. after analyzing what chemo would help YOU) and that is why it is so hard to recommend something.

Ok, no more writing today for me... just can't forget my disappeared email....
Hugs, Vilca

[pog451]

Thanks for taking the time to respond, Vilca, especially if your original post vanished (it can sometimes be a problem with your browser rather than this forum, if that happens)

I like the way you have clearly posted your personal experiences (which don't seem to have been so earth-shatteringly great) and I hope you continue to find things that help you on your journey.

Hope I answered Pog's question, though not as elaborate as I outlined in my disappeared email.

Unfortunately not really, but then im a bit of a truth fascist - I tend to only believe stuff that has been shown to be (to the best of our knowledge) correct by studies (at best several and a meta). Thanks anyway.

BTW - I would point out that this:

Only 5% of the patients survive on alternative treatment, according to what I've read a few years ago.

..is pretty much exactly the historical survival rate for Stage IV CRC patients, including those who never had any treatment at all. The *overall" survival rate for people on conventional allopathic treatment paths is multiples higher (I don't have the number to hand). That, to my mind, (although again I wouldn't believe that number until I saw some good studies) rather puts the kybosh on any claims that "alternative" treatments are very effective

[annalexandria]

Bob ,
Did you ever get any info on the difference in using xeloda without oxi compared to with? I've had six rounds with oxi and two to go" I'm afraid the side effects are going to be worse these last two and would love to cut out the oxi.

I don't know how accurate this is, but according to my oncologist, the oxi accounts for only a 5% improvement in outcomes. He was always willing to cut it back, or remove it if necessary, as it seemed to have the most debilitating long-term effects.