The Colon Club

Good morning,

I realize that certain vitamins have strong anti-oxidant properties, and therefore, can interfere with the function of chemotherapy drugs. I am interested in supplements such as zinc, iron and B Complex; now that I'm commuting in crowded conditions during cold weather months, I would like to enhance my defenses. I'm currently undergoing a Folfox 6 and Avastin regimen.

Thank you.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
49 yr old M, metastatic adenocarcinoma of colon
colon bypass surgery performed 7/2012
PT/CT scans showed tumor cells in liver, lungs and lymph nodes
Fulfox started 9/10/2012, Fulfox and Avastin administered subsequently
alanams

Research the supplements. My husband has taken supplements since the beginning with the approval of the oncologist and other doctors involved. Same is great mood enhancer, he takes immune building supplements, ip-6, many others.

Ask your doc about all suppliments as there are some that have negative effects with chemo. B12 is one that should NOT be taken on days you're being infused with 5FU as it amplifies the effects of 5FU by causing it to stay in the system longer and do more damage to all of your dividing cells. Excess side effects is a common thing when you suppliment B12 while on 5FU. My oncologist told me to not take my multivitamin any days I had the pump on. He said other days were fine since B12 is a water soluble vitamin and doesn't linger that long in the system.

Iron is fine on chemo, many folks that are mildly anemic as a result of diagnosis/surgery are perscribed it even. I prefer getting my iron through my diet though cause the pills constipate the HELL out of me. Egg yolks with OJ worked better than iron pills, was far tastier, and did not constipate me. It's important to mix the citric acid, vitamin C, and the yolks all together. The constipation was giving me anal fissures with the chemo. Zinc I have no knowledge of whether it's good/bad/indifferent with chemo. Ask your doc the dose you're planning on taking

I was told to limit my supplements to a daily multi-vitamin during chemo. Later on, my Onc agreed to adding Turmeric, D3 and calcium/magnesium to my list.

Warning on the calcium/magnesium ... be careful with taking that in combination with D3 as together, they can lead to hypercalcemia. That was remedied by stopping my supplements for a couple of weeks.

Good luck.

Came across this reference Here while checking for effects of my Dad's chemo regimen. Thought it may play into this discussion as it was done with CRC patients on chemo.

also found a neat biochemistry tutorial on folate B12 if you are stuck inside on a rainy wet coast day like I have here !

Cheers
CRguy

Natural folates need to be carefully distinguished from synthetic folic acid in common multivitamins and enriched (wheat) products. Folic acid meant increased stomatitis to us, whereas natural folates enabled higher 5FU levels and leucovorin with less problems than lower chemo doses with folic acid content present. Zero folic acid content in food and supplements was the best answer for us. Some supplements have folinic acid (leucovorin) or natural type folates in them, instead.

I've been involved with my dad's cancer treatment since January. He has stage 4 colon cancer in the mesentary (no organs though), 78 yrs old.

We've been using the following which are indicated to have direct anti cancer effects ..
curcumin
vitamin D3 & k mix (he was quite low but we've finally been able to get his levels up to a high range)
melatonin 3 mg
liposomal vitamin C (specially mixed powdered C in lethicin) for 12 grams of vit C a day (equiv to about 50 grams of normal C)
Coriolus mushroom
Lunsin XP (a long chain soy peptide)
green tea extract
whole grape extract (resvertrol, etc)
saffron for liver protection

In addition we're also keeping his immune system up with a B complex, NAC, ALA, CoQ10, fish oil, and more. Also some prescription based cancer fighters too like metformin, cimetidine, and just trying out Celebrex.

He's going thru 5-FU with Avastin now. As you can see I subscribe to the shotgun approach. We won't have a second chance to fight this cancer off. So far he's doing well but he did come down with a very nasty bout of shingles recently which required the chemo to stop for a few weeks.

Hope this gives you some ideas for tings to possibly use in your treatment. Good luck to all!

Edit: I want to add that there are NO studies showing that vitamins interfere with chemo treatments. Quite the converse, actually. A lot of "old school" oncologists just adapted that attitude based on the precepts of chemo.

My oncologist said nothing on infusion days otherwise as long as I didn't do anything with blood thinning properties or heavy antioxidants was fine. I am all about trying every angle possible!

alanams wrote:Good morning,

I realize that certain vitamins have strong anti-oxidant properties, and therefore, can interfere with the function of chemotherapy drugs. I am interested in supplements such as zinc, iron and B Complex; now that I'm commuting in crowded conditions during cold weather months, I would like to enhance my defenses. I'm currently undergoing a Folfox 6 and Avastin regimen.

Thank you.
----------------------------------------------------------------------------------------------
49 yr old M, metastatic adenocarcinoma of colon
colon bypass surgery performed 7/2012
PT/CT scans showed tumor cells in liver, lungs and lymph nodes
Fulfox started 9/10/2012, Fulfox and Avastin administered subsequently
alanams

Hi there! It is very good to research all suppliments before just taking them as some of them will really interfere with chemo. Some other enhance it and made side effects easier. We have created our own homemade "protocol" by reading 6 different anti-cancer books but two of them outlined herbs/supplements/vitamins that were good to take and specificially with certain chemo meds. They also explained what NOT to take(this is very important). We have a very good system now and my husband is doing so well that on his 5th treatment his oncologist actually increased his Oxaliplatin dosage this time around because he has been handling it so well. His onocologist has approved everything we are taking and we believe it really helps him. PM me and I will tell you our specific protocol. It has kept his WBC AND as of this week his platelet count went up.

Hi at all,

@ Hi, SoConfused

Calcium could help our inmune system to encysting the lesions ... I like it.
@ Hi, alanams

Could you check about VITAMIN E so as to get a strong anti-oxidant properties

@ Hi, My friend ...SkiFletch

Iron=> respect to the Eggs yolks with OJ worked better than iron pills...totally agree but It could damage my liver added to a lot of pills?
It's important to mix the citric acid, vitamin C, and the yolks all together. where I could get the citric acid? are you talking about lemons or oranges or what ???

@Hi, rp1954

Zero folic acid content in food and supplements was the best answer for us. Some supplements have folinic acid (leucovorin) or natural type folates in them, instead.

I wish to know wich are the foods or supplements containing Zero folic Acid ? I gave at my grandfather folic acid but bought it in the pharmacy, not sure if it is?

@Hi Breezy,

I was researching a lot of anti cancer effects devices too, in order to help at my father too... I found interesting some products you have mentioned.
I am trying to be carefull with some of them, but trying to use my ideas and my friends ideas => mixing some of the devices you well-described.

Respect to Vitamins it would be interesting to open a new thread ... no??

1. curcumin
2. vitamin D3 & k mix (he was quite low but we've finally been able to get his levels up to a high range)

It could be ....Coriolus mushroom, the problem is to get it with high quality and this specific type of mushroom.

3. green tea extract ... only if it has a high quality
4. Reverastrol => whole grape extract (resvertrol, etc)
5. saffron for liver protection

In addition we're also keeping his immune system up with a B complex, NAC, ALA, CoQ10, fish oil, and more.
PERHAPS HERE EXISTS SOME KEYS...
Also some prescription based cancer fighters too like metformin, cimetidine, and just trying out Celebrex.

Respect to B complex it helps, but as far as my friend Sky told us, be careful with B12.

He's going thru 5-FU with Avastin now. As you can see I subscribe to the shotgun approach. We won't have a second chance to fight this cancer off. So far he's doing well but he did come down with a very nasty bout of shingles recently which required the chemo to stop for a few weeks.

MY FATHER IS UNDER XELOX NOW and I am subscriber to the shotgun too.

A lot of "old school" oncologists just adapted that attitude based on the precepts of chemo SHOULD LEAVE THIS CAREER, THEY WERE A TOTAL FAILURE, in the lastest 4 decades no improvements in this f..cking disease. The GLOBAL ONCOLOGY SHOULD BE RESCHEDULE, WE HAVE EVERYDAYS PROOFS THAT IT IS NOT WORKING.

@Hi, Lara

Could I write you other PM ... I wish to read your own specific protocol too, so interesting work, reading 6 books so as to help chemo for working better.

Great post, evidently the INMUNE SYSTEM and its FUEL, is perhaps other KEY TO SOLVE THE CRAZY MUTUATIONS AND ADN DAMAGES.

Fede

Fede, of course, PM me and we cam discuss it!

Fede wrote:@Hi, rp1954 ....Zero folic acid content in food and supplements was the best answer for us. Some supplements have folinic acid (leucovorin) or natural type folates in them, instead.

I wish to know wich are the foods or supplements containing Zero folic Acid ? I gave at my grandfather folic acid but bought it in the pharmacy, not sure if it is?

It's the synthetic folic acid that is so toxic. There are about 8 forms of natural folate, many intermediate forms in foliage like you get from juicing. I think L5MTHF is the final natural folate of the human body. L5MTHF doesn't effectively compete with 5,10 methylene tetrahydrifolate (from leucovorin) to stablize the cancer inhibitory 5FU ternary product. The combination of 5-FU with the 5,10 methylene tetrahydrofolate Cofactor, from leucovorin, stabilizes the ternary complex of 5-fluorodeoxyuridine monophosphate-thymidylate synthetase-5,10 methylene tetrahydrofolate, increasing DNA inhibition and 5-FU cytotoxicity. We use leucovorin for the cancer inhibitory effect of 5FU, we use liver with L5MTHF for the health of the body. Juicers appear to be using the mixed natural folates from leaves, "foli"age, for far fewer chemo side effects in the cases.

Hi there. I'm on FOLFOX 6, currently pump connected with my 5th treatment (of 12).

I'm taking all the following supplements with dr's approval:

b-complex - 1xs day
b6 - 100mg (50mg 2xs day)
l-lycine - 1000mg daily (500mg 2xs day)
glutamine - 30grams daily (when I can, 30 is a lot to get in one day, I've made homemade glutamine pills to supplement and it's cheaper than buying in the store)
potassium - 1xs day

the top 4 are for neuropathy. the potassium is for foot and toe cramps which crop up days 1 and 2 of treatment.

since I don't have a baseline, I can't tell you if it's helping with neuropathy but i can tell you that 5 treatments in, it's definitely gotten worse, but worse is relative. it's only cold induced (and "cold" is really not that cold, i can't be in a room under 68 degrees without gloves) BUT it definitely subsides day by day, last time it was completely gone in 10 days but days 7-10 were extraordinarily mild. it doesn't interfere with my daily activities. i do have a feeling it would be worse w/o the supplements, so I gladly toss back sometimes upwards of 30 pills a day (that includes 20+ homemade glutamine).


=========
tahiti
dx CC 7/12 age 44
resection 8/2012, path came back stage iib - age 45
folfox6 started 10/1/12, hope to be complete 3/13/13

I've consulted with a natriopathic oncologist. I am taking supplements during chemo, when my stomach can handle it. Not sure if it will make a difference, but it's worth a try based on the research I have done and what I have been advised my my ND. Here is a list:

Curcumin
Vit d
Vit b6
Resveratrol
Omega 3
Milk thistle
Psk
Ahcc
Probiotic
Calcium
Co q10
I will also be staring icador mistletoe shortly. I have also considered iv vitamin c, but it is a bit costly and I'm not sure I can afford it.

During chemo, I took Vitamin D, Calcium, Glutamine and Probiotics (VSL3). I also took either B6 or B12 but can't remember which ( ). These were all at my own initiative but the oncologist was aware and did not object.