My Mothers Story

[Nickipat]

Hello everyone and thank you in advance for your support and comments.

A little history on my mothers story. 79 years old.

She has been complaining over the last 6 months about severe abdominal pains that last for days. loose stool, gas, hiccups, vomiting,

back in Dec 09 went for ultrasound and showed back up constipation and stones in her gallbladder. Went to see a surgeon 3 weeks later and he wanted to perform more tests due to her weak heart to make sure that when he did do surgery he doesn't need to go in again after the gallbladder has been removed.

she was booked in for Colonoscopy. He couldn't get past a large blockage. tried again one week later. same thing. But he couldn't see it either because it was on a bend.

He then booked her for CT scan but had to wait 2 weeks due to the line up.

A week before her CT scan we rushed her to hospital with severe pains again. Vomiting constantly almost black, stools black. ankles swollen. shortness of breath. shaking.

I should also say that her heart is weak after a severe Heart attack 13 yrs ago. (1/4 of heart is not functioning.)

2 days later CT scan showed orange size tumor in colon and several mets to liver.

surgery to remove part of colon and gallbladder successful.

Liver has several tumors inside and on.

Dr advised this surgery was done to give herShe pain free quality of life she has left. He advised against chemo due to her heart condition she wont survive it. Dr has booked her to see the Oncologist.

looking to see if anyone else has a similar story to share and what we as a family are looking at as far as time she has left with us. Has anyone else had a loved one with a weak heart and had Chemo?
She has been very tired last couple days and since been taken to the hospital 3 weeks ago has lost 15 lbs.

This has been a lot to absorb in the last couple weeks.

Thank you so much for your comments!

Nicole

[John603]

Nicole,

I would suggest reserving judgment on chemotherapy until after you talk with the oncologist. No offense to your surgeon, but it isn't his area of expertise. (I'm assuming that the surgeon has ruled out liver surgery already?) If the oncologist concurs with the surgeon, then just try and focus on making sure that your mother eats healthy foods, gets some exercise (obviously approved by her doctor), and a good amount of rest. You could also look into things like SIR Spheres, RFA, cyberknife, etc. I'm not sure if her age and physical condition would preclude these treatments or not. She definitely sounds like a fighter (13 yrs with a weakened heart and dealing with a full blockage of the colon).

Good Luck.

John

[Nickipat]

Hi John you are correct. The Dr did suggest that the Oncologist would know better about her heart and Chemo. She is a fighter, has been her whole life. We purchased some Essiac for her and she is taking that 2 times a day. She has always taken Vitamins and also eats very well. They cannot preform surgery on her liver. Too many mets apparently. i have just found out in the last couple weeks that my Grandmother and Uncle succumbed to colon cancer at 77 and 81 years of age. It runs in our family.
thank you
Nicole

[pearlgirl]

i have just found out in the last couple weeks that my Grandmother and Uncle succumbed to colon cancer at 77 and 81 years of age. It runs in our family.
thank you
Nicole

Just an aside, but an important one... If someone in your family has had colon cancer, family members should be tested for it sooner than the standard recommended age of 50. Usually it would be 10 years younger than the age of the cancer patient at diagnosis (i.e. if grandma was diagnosed at age 49, family members should be tested at age 39). One caveat - if you or any other family members are showing symptoms, no matter what your age, you should be scoped!

[hannahw]

Like John said, I would talk to the oncologist. But I would also keep in mind, and I hope this won't seem too harsh, that there are worse things than death. There are many things we can do to treat a disease, but we don't always ask the question about what we should do. And why. As difficult as it can be to hear, with certain underlying health conditions, there are very good reasons why doctors are reluctant to press forward with interventional therapy - the potential harms outweigh the potential benefits. Sometimes the kindest, most courageous thing a doctor can do is provide guidance to a patient that helps the patient determine when it is time to stop with interventional therapy.

People often talk about a patient being a fighter, I think of my own Dad this way, but I also worry that it sets us up for problems. It is easy to get it in your head that stopping interventional therapy is quitting, giving up, not fighting. It's an affront to our very human nature which has hard wired us to live. But when you think about how far medicine has come (for example, it wasn't all that long ago that the DNR did not exist because there was no such thing as a ventilator) there becomes a very real question about whether we reach a point where we're no longer prolonging life, but simply delaying death and at a high cost to quality of life. So, I don't think the choice to stop interventional therapy indicates quitting, giving up, weakness, failure to fight or any other negative. It is recognition that we are all going to die and sometimes interventional therapy will not stop it or delay it significantly and/or that the cost in pain/suffering is far too high.

I think part of what makes these decisions so difficult is that there's no sure thing. The doctor might tell you the chemo is too harsh on a person with a heart condition, but maybe your mother is the exception. Maybe she would do quite well. It's hard to turn away from the possibility, no matter how remote, especially knowing that the alternative is death. Plus, everyone has a different threshold for what qualifies as "beneficial." Another year of life? Another month? With what quality? Bed-ridden? Somnolent? Tied to various machines? There are two points that might cause someone to take heed. One, some treatments cause so many complications that they actually cause death to come sooner than if no interventional therapy were undertaken. Two, some treatments cause so many complications that they destroy quality of life.

As a daughter I want my Dad to live. Forever. Seriously. I want him to live FOREVER. And there are moments when I can honestly say I'd make a deal with the devil to get it done. I'm so afraid of my Dad dying that I forget to be afraid of the suffering that can come from treating the disease too aggressively and for too long. When I take the time to really think about it I realize I don't just want my Dad to live. I want him to live well. And on his terms. And I hope that when he's ready to stop - whether ever last option has been exhausted or not - that I'll have the strength and courage to accept and support his decision and ensure that he is physically and emotionally supported at the end of his life.

[bdurant]

I feel your pain. We'll never have another Mother. I am sure that having you to comfort and to love her, she's getting the most important part of any treatment. Did you read about Tagamet? Also, Tumeric does help, if you give her the capsules give them with food.
My prayers and best wishes are with you both.

[karin]

Nicole,

Whatever the doc's say, I just want to remind you, never give up hope.

There was a post on here not long ago from a lady whose mom, at age 80, was diagnosed with late stage crc, and, they did start chemo, but, after one treatment her mom said, thanks, but, no thanks!! So they put her on PSK mushroom extract and another alternative, I can't remember which, and she is alive and doing well 2 years later!!!

I lost my mother in 1993, melanoma with mets to liver (2 years disease free after surgery). She did have a recurrence though, with 18 spots in and on her liver, unresectable of course. The onc at that time gave her 3 to 6 months, she lived 43 days. She was 70. There was little to offer her at that time, but, we did try interferon, which really gave her no side effects, but was very unhelpful. I lived in NY at that time, but came back to TX as soon as it all happened, and stayed by her side till the end. She simply lost all her strength, was unable to eat or drink, and eventually just went to sleep. It was very peaceful. Hospice, of course, was very helpful.

As hannahw says, there are things worse than death, but, having a daughter like you who is loving and supportive and who will advocate for her will make the treatment course, if chosen, more tolerable for her. If that is not in her best interest, of course, the palliative course will be so much easier for her, as well, knowing that you are there and supporting her. There are no wrong answers, and, unfortunately, sometimes, the choices just aren't there.

I am so sorry that you have to be here, but, please know we welcome you and we are here for you. I am sending warmest wishes and strongest positive thoughts and prayers to you and your family.
Luv and hugs, Karin

[white swan]

Nicole,
It was my mother who stopped chemo and I put her on PSK and Cimetidine (Tagamet). She was given 2 to 3 monthes to live in Feb. 09. She will be 83 in May. She takes a bus to the casinos in Biloxi (we live in Mobile, an hour away) twice a week. We took our annual trip to New York in October 08 and she walked all over the city, not to mention up and down the steps to the subway. She feels better than she has in years. We go to the oncologist every 3 monthes and her bloodwork is great, cea level .9 (it was 78 before surgery). The onc. just says "keep doing whatever your doing". She takes 3,000 mg of PSK and 800mg of Cimetidine a day. She ate cottage cheese and Flaxseed Oil with ground flaxseed (Budwig Diet) for about a month. I suggest researching on the web to find out what would be best for her situation. There are so many alternative therapies that have little or no side effects. Google : self help cancer complimentary alternative treatment. I hope all goes well.
white swan

[Terry]

You and your mother have to decide how she wants to live her last years. Quality of life is so important. She's 79 and only has 1/4 of her heart working so chances are without the cancer she probably wouldn't live to be 100 (although you never know). A lot of depends on how she feels about death. The onc. may suggest 5FU which isn't as awful as oxi or irinotecan, I'm just not sure with her heart condition that any of the chemos would be a good thing. There's also the question of how much cancer is left in here body. At her age she may get years without the chemo.

It's a hard decision I'm sure. Make sure you write all of your questions down on a piece of paper so you don't forget anything.

Let us know what happens and what you all decide.

You and your mom are in my thoughts and prayers.
Terry

[Nickipat]

Thank you Everyone for your comments, support and prayers.
I truly appreciate each one of you for your input.
She has an apt with the oncologist on March 23rd. I will let you know what happens.
Yesterday was not a very good day for Mom. She was very tired and had pains on her right side, and just wanted to go and have a nap. Today was a little better, but she still was tired.
14 yrs ago I lost my father to cancer as well. Started in his Jaw muscle they operated, Radiation and reconstructed surgery. If you can imagine your shoulder muscle attached to your jaw for 8 weeks as it grew into the tissue. And they had to remove all his fillings in his mouth before radiation. 2 years later, He did have mets to his Brain and it was inoperable. He found out Nov 15 1995 ( my 32 Birthday and 7 months Pregnant at the time) And he passed away Feb 13th 1996. My mother looked after him the whole time at home. She remembers how much pain and suffering he went through while he was getting his radiation treatments and she has said she does not want to suffer like him as it did not give him the quality of life he wanted.
These feelings are starting to surface again...
I will keep you posted and thank you again everyone.
Nicole

[Nickipat]

They have postponed my mothers apt with the Onc until April 7th..... I hate waiting.

[Nickipat]

Hello everyone,

Update on my Mother.

We saw the Oncoligist yesterday.

my mother had 10 of the 20 lympnodes positive also she has mets to liver heavy and her abdomen lining.

He advised her maybe a year without treatment. with 6 months of Chemo it may prolong her life an extra year.

She has decided to not take chemo.

She will continue on her Essiac and vitamins and take it day by day. Please pray for her......

[weisssoccermom]

Nicole,

Thank you for updating us. Truly I can and do understand your mom's reluctance to take the chemo. While I firmly believe in it (chemo) as a very viable treatment, there's no disputing that it's one rough road to travel. Considering your mom's age and her already frail health I can totally understand where she is coming from with respect to her decision. There may be some who disagree with the doctor's recommendations and/or your mom's decisions, but only she can decide what she can handle - no one else can do this for her.

I wish I could tell you what the future holds for you and your family - how much time you have left, what her quality of life will be like, etc. but none of us can. Just be there for her and let her know that you and her grandkids love her and support her. This may sound very silly but lately, I've been realizing that there are events in my past - silly things such as the address of the house I lived in until I was 4, or something that I remembered from a family vacation over 40 years ago that I want clarification on - that I can't ask questions about any longer because both of my parents are gone. Talk to your mom, ask her questions - questions about what things were like when you were little, questions about your parents, whatever - but talk to her. Take some time to spend looking and having some good laughs over your school or vacation pictures. AS you now know that there is a family history of colorectal cancer, make sure that you get yourself in (preferably sooner than later) and have a colonoscopy. Do it now for your mom so that she can know that you're ok. According to a previous post of yours - you'll be 47 this year - so GET IN AND GET SCOPED.

Nicole, please make sure you take care of yourself and your child(ren). All of you will be facing an unknown future and some difficult times ahead. Cherish those moments and allow yourself time to make special memories with your mom and don't forget to allow your kids to have those special times with their grandma. It may just be the best 'medicine' for your mom as well.

Best wishes, prayers and hugs are being sent your way.

Jaynee

[Nickipat]

update on my mom. My mom is having trouble eating no appetite at all and nausea. All she can have is ensure at about 11amish. Her back is starting to hurt and her heartburn is daily. she has night sweats after 5 mins of doing something she has to sit down. I have bought her some gravol for the nausea that she has every morning and some zantex for heartburn. Is the back pain due to the liver?

thank you

nicole

[weisssoccermom]

Nicole,

Depending on where the pain is (upper or lower, etc), yes it could be from her liver. It also could be due to a number of other reasons, ranging from the way she walks (her posture putting a lot of strain on muscles) to everything, up and including, unfortunately, mets to her bones. I'm certainly not saying that that is what she has - just that it is a possibility. Please make sure you or your mom speaks with her doctor about pain relief and tells the onc specifically where the pain is so that he/she can have a better idea of what drugs might be the most beneficial for your mom.

Truly, I am so sorry about the way your mom's disease is progressing. I can't imagine how difficult it must be for you to watch her be in pain and discomfort. I only wish I had the 'right' words that could make all of this go away - make it all somehow better - but unfortunately I just don't. Please know that all of us are here for you whenever you need anything. PM any of us if you just need to talk or whatever you need to do. This is a tough time both for you and your mom. You're a wonderful daughter to be taking care of your mom with such loving devotion but remember to take care of yourself as well. Your own children need their mom for them right now as well. It's really hard having to be so many different entities when everyone is looking to you for support. You have to be 'mom' to your own children, a 'daughter' to your mom and a caregiver as well. Just remember that you also are important - take care of yourself, please!

Thoughts, prayers and hugs,
Jaynee