The Hazards of Sugar

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jenhopesprays
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The Hazards of Sugar

Postby jenhopesprays » Sun Jan 03, 2010 10:56 pm

I responded to a post about sugar and cancer and posted what the American Cancer Society had to say about sugar. So we don't have evidence it promotes cancer but it sure as heck promotes 15 other serious illnesses. Like the ACS said its bad for you so don't eat it.

I just watched a series done by an Endocrinologist at UCSF regarding Fructose/Sucrose and am utterly shocked by what goes on on the molecular level. I knew HFCS was not good for you but I had no idea how bad.

I am putting it here to share... Curious what you think?

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=WjxyjcvW7RE
Stage IV: dx 8/07 at 39.. colon & liver resection & rt ovary
17 rounds of folfox.
12/08 ovary tumor removed with HIPEC & folfiri w/Avastin
9/11 liver resection # 2 followed by chemo
NED

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jscho
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Re: The Hazards of Sugar

Postby jscho » Mon Jan 04, 2010 12:23 pm

Recently there was an article suggesting an interesting connection between microenvironments of low glucose (i.e at a cellular level) and the development of Kras and Braf mutations. Apparently the glucose transporter (Glut1) is upregulated in cells with these mutations, which help cells survive under conditions of low glucose.

See:
J. Yun et al., Science, Vol 325, page 1555 (2009).

To be clear, of course this research does NOT suggest that a high sugar diet will help prevent Kras and Braf mutations.

This has little to do with your post, but is interesting.
Colon cancer dx Feb. 24, 2009, T3/N2/M0
Right Hemicolectomy Feb. 26, 2009
Stage 3C: 4/19 positive nodes
High grade adenocarcinoma with tumor budding
FOLFOX6 April 15 - Oct. 1, 2009
Elective sub-total colectomy July 3, 2012 due to 2 DALMs
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Terry
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Re: The Hazards of Sugar

Postby Terry » Mon Jan 04, 2010 12:39 pm

It's more of watching your hemoglobin level than sugar which includes carbs (complex carbs). You want your insulin level (can check a 3 month average level with a test calle HgA1C-hemoglobin A1C) to remain below 6 I believe. It's when we bring our insulin levels way up and then with simple carbs (sugar) it drops, this is where we have trouble. Also when you have a cold or bacterial infection it's important to remain away from the sugars because bacteria grows in sugar, that's one of the mediums they use to grow bacteria. But I think eating a piece of dark chocolate when your craving something sweet won't hurt and is actually good for you. I'm really trying to cut out my sweets and I've been doing really well since right after Christmas. The one thing I notice is that the less you eat them, the less you crave them.

Jaynee (weisssoccermom) and I were just talking also because my CEA went up and hers did also six weeks or so ago (pray for her test from last week to come back down) and we're wondering if because we were eating to much sugar that may play a role. I guess if both of our come back down (wouldn't that be a Godsend:) it may be very possible.
DX 7/3/07
Chemo, radiation, 20 mo. chemo, IMRT, cyberknife, 6/11 lobectomy.
1/16 resection perm. colostomy intraop. rad.
PET 2/12 nose, thyroid, liver, lngs
Folfox 3/12
Lord I know You'll keep me here until
you know I cannot suffer any longer!

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jenhopesprays
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Re: The Hazards of Sugar

Postby jenhopesprays » Mon Jan 04, 2010 3:58 pm

Praying for Jaynee and you to Terry for a drop in CEA.

jscho: This doctor is passionately adamant that a "calorie is no calorie" as he previously thought. He equates pasta with glucose (the power of life) and fructose/sucrose with a completely different mechanism. He explains how on the cellular level fructose/sucrose breaks down in the liver in a very harmful way, similar to alcohol.

High Fructose Corn Syrup which is in just about everything does not sent the receptor to the brain to alert for satiety. That is the reason it's so harmful. HFCS does not release the leptin hormone which causes all the trouble.

The only thing new (to me) is that glucose has the trigger and HFCS does not and is very dangerous because of this lack of trigger.
Stage IV: dx 8/07 at 39.. colon & liver resection & rt ovary
17 rounds of folfox.
12/08 ovary tumor removed with HIPEC & folfiri w/Avastin
9/11 liver resection # 2 followed by chemo
NED

Have Hope with Capitol H

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EBMJ
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Re: The Hazards of Sugar

Postby EBMJ » Mon Jan 04, 2010 7:03 pm

This whole sugar debate really sucks. It is just one more thing I need to feel guilty about in my diet. In my chemo cycle I have about a 3 day period where everything tastes like cardboard. The only thing that tastes normal and good is sweets. I find myself eating ice cream and milkshakes to make sure I keep my calories up. I really wish there was a definitive answer on this. I think we all deserve some guiltfree pleasures.

Jim
51 year old male, DX: Stage IV CC with liver mets 07
Too many Surgeries
Too much chemo
Too much radiation
PM me if you want the details

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jmarie
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Re: The Hazards of Sugar

Postby jmarie » Mon Jan 04, 2010 7:22 pm

EBMJ wrote:This whole sugar debate really sucks. It is just one more thing I need to feel guilty about in my diet. In my chemo cycle I have about a 3 day period where everything tastes like cardboard. The only thing that tastes normal and good is sweets. I find myself eating ice cream and milkshakes to make sure I keep my calories up. I really wish there was a definitive answer on this. I think we all deserve some guiltfree pleasures.

Jim


A few ways I have been trying to trick my sweet tooth is sugar free candy or gum, I am addicted to anything cinnamon. I also do carnation milkshakes. Strawberry smoothies with yougurt, frozen strawberries and a little agave nectar do the trick for me. Agave Nectar tastes like honey to me, but is pretty low on the Glycemic index.
DX Stage IV 11/25/08
mets liver lung, kras mutant
Baby 2yrs old! I am 32yrs
Too many chemo txs to count
trying to find a clinical trial
"You can't stop the waves, but you can learn to surf"

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jenhopesprays
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Re: The Hazards of Sugar

Postby jenhopesprays » Mon Jan 04, 2010 8:06 pm

Jim,

Put the guilt down. Step away from the guilt. You have enough on your plate and need to Carpe your Diem. Enjoying some sweets is probably a good thing.

I posted this because I have always been very interested in health and diet. Most people know that drinking soda is unhealthy but juice is really just the same thing.

There a lots of folks who are juicing everything for a cancer benefit. To each his own but it seems to me that we should use caution with juicing too as it seems to break down the same way as a can of coke.

Jmarie:

Funny I have Agave and was hoping to use it to sweeten my tea.

Wiki answers says:

Agave nectar consists primarily of fructose and glucose. Due to its fructose content and the fact that the glycemic index measures only glucose levels, agave nectar is notable in that its glycemic index and glycemic load are lower than many other natural sweeteners on the market. However, the extremely high percentage of fructose can be just as bad as glucose.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Agave_nectar

Does that mean that there is no good substitution?

What do you think Jmarie
Stage IV: dx 8/07 at 39.. colon & liver resection & rt ovary
17 rounds of folfox.
12/08 ovary tumor removed with HIPEC & folfiri w/Avastin
9/11 liver resection # 2 followed by chemo
NED

Have Hope with Capitol H

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Terry
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Re: The Hazards of Sugar

Postby Terry » Mon Jan 04, 2010 8:24 pm

Juice breaks down the same as soda! ABSOLUTELY incorrect! God made the fruits for us to eat, man made white sugar. Our bodies were meant to live on what God gave us, fruits, vegetables, animals, grains. Where we have the problems with health (IMO) is the things that man has made, white flour, white sugar, msg, etc.

Jim don't worry about sweets once in a while. When I was on oxi certain sweets were the only thing that tasted good and when I start ironotecan back if it's the same, I'll be eating my sweet. Just eat it in moderation.
DX 7/3/07
Chemo, radiation, 20 mo. chemo, IMRT, cyberknife, 6/11 lobectomy.
1/16 resection perm. colostomy intraop. rad.
PET 2/12 nose, thyroid, liver, lngs
Folfox 3/12
Lord I know You'll keep me here until
you know I cannot suffer any longer!

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jenhopesprays
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Re: The Hazards of Sugar

Postby jenhopesprays » Mon Jan 04, 2010 10:28 pm

Terry,

I respect your opinion but am curious if you watched the link. I know its lengthy but explains it so much better than I ever could.

Dr Lustig at UCSF who has done the research on The Hazards of Sugar clearly does not agree that the juice of an orange is the same as eating the orange. He speaks about sugar being the essence of the sugar cane yet is harmful when processed.

He also asserts that we would not be able to eat enough fruits and vegies to overdue the fructose at a meal when eaten whole and that God packaged fruits as they should be eaten fiber and all. He does a wonderful job explaining why scientifically and on a molecular level the affects on the body and more specifically the liver when we consume large amounts of fructose which is what happens when we drink juice.

I'm not the doc and it's not my opinion.

Just food for thought.
Stage IV: dx 8/07 at 39.. colon & liver resection & rt ovary
17 rounds of folfox.
12/08 ovary tumor removed with HIPEC & folfiri w/Avastin
9/11 liver resection # 2 followed by chemo
NED

Have Hope with Capitol H

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Re: The Hazards of Sugar

Postby Terry » Tue Jan 05, 2010 12:30 am

Did you read the latest study done at Mayo Clinic. It condones, approves (can't think of the word I want) the juicing of fruits. You suppose to leave the skins on everything which is where the fiber is. I've done a lot of research into juicing so I guess it's a whose right and whose wrong. PUt it this way, your body needs the nutrients from fruits and vegetables and the best way to have them is to eat them in the whole form but if you can't do that like me the next best choice is to juice them.

Frankly, you can't be sure any of them are right, you just have to go with your gut (no pun intended) and what you feel is right. For me juicing because I'm just not a fruit or vegetable eater. I might eat one serving of each a day but that's it. You know on the American diabetic Associations diet or the ADA diet you can have fruits whole or juiced and I really think it's all about the insulin level more than anything.
DX 7/3/07
Chemo, radiation, 20 mo. chemo, IMRT, cyberknife, 6/11 lobectomy.
1/16 resection perm. colostomy intraop. rad.
PET 2/12 nose, thyroid, liver, lngs
Folfox 3/12
Lord I know You'll keep me here until
you know I cannot suffer any longer!

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jenhopesprays
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Re: The Hazards of Sugar

Postby jenhopesprays » Tue Jan 05, 2010 12:56 am

I agree that you have to go with your gut. Sounds like juicing makes sense for you if you can't handle the fiber of the whole fruit.

I would love to read the Mayo study. Could you post the link if you can find it?
Stage IV: dx 8/07 at 39.. colon & liver resection & rt ovary
17 rounds of folfox.
12/08 ovary tumor removed with HIPEC & folfiri w/Avastin
9/11 liver resection # 2 followed by chemo
NED

Have Hope with Capitol H

jscho
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Re: The Hazards of Sugar

Postby jscho » Tue Jan 05, 2010 9:46 am

I finally had time to look at the youtube video and found it very interesting. Dr. Lustig is a wonderful lecturer (aside from his frequent use of the work "ok"), and I found myself drawn in and actually watched the whole video. I agree completely with his general conclusions about the cause of the "metabolic syndrome" and the evils of excessive consumption of sucrose or corn syrup. He explained the mechanism of how the metabolism of fructose leads to obesity and cardiovascular disease beautifully.

As for my impressions of the content, I think his presentation is a bit alarmist in calling fructose a "toxin". As a chemist, I noticed he oversimplified the biochemistry of metabolism quite a bit.

Specific comments:

1. Fructose can be metabolized by muscle and kidney cells using the same enzyme (hexokinase) that starts glucose metabolism. Hexokinase binds glucose much better than fructose (the rate constant for glucose metabolism is 100 time larger than that of fructose), so the majority of fructose does reach the liver, but it is not the "only" metabolic pathway for fructose.

2. The claim that fructose is toxic to the liver for the same reason that alcohol is toxic is not really true. Even small amounts of alcohol can damage the liver because ethanol is broken down into acetaldehyde by alcohol dehydrogenase. This aldehyde is harmful since it is not rapidly metabolized (as opposed to glyceraldehyde produced in the breakdown of fructose), and aldehydes are reactive with proteins, potentially damaging them. Furthermore, reactive oxygen species are not produced in the metabolism of fructose. However it is true that an excess of fructose can lead to hepatitis and fatty deposits in the liver by the same mechanisms as the breakdown of alcohol. The issue in both cases is one of volume overload.

3. For someone battling cancer, the lack of a rapid glycemic response to fructose is very significant, since high levels of insulin lead to higher concentrations of free insulin growth factor (IGF) which stimulates cell division and tumor growth. Thus even if the overall glycemic load of a given number of grams of sucrose and pure glucose is the same, the slower absorption of sucrose (due to the fructose in it) leads to a lower insulin spike. In a recent article on the benefit of exercise to avoid recurrence in colorectal cancer, the authors speculate that the mechanism of the benefit is likely the increased sensitivity of the body to insulin due to exercise, which lowers the level of insulin in the body and therefore IGF. See J. Meyerhardt et al., Arch. Intern Med., Vol. 169, page 2102, 2009

4. Small amounts of fructose consumption is not harmful, and using fructose-based sweeteners is modest amounts (in coffee etc.) is not a worry. Fructose tastes "sweeter", and should be used in smaller amounts than sucrose or glucose. However, as Dr. Lustig points out, care should be taken to avoid large amounts of corn syrup as this overloads the liver into producing fatty acids and fat deposits.

Thanks for posting the link! I found it very informative.

This is just my 2 cents.
Jeremy
Colon cancer dx Feb. 24, 2009, T3/N2/M0
Right Hemicolectomy Feb. 26, 2009
Stage 3C: 4/19 positive nodes
High grade adenocarcinoma with tumor budding
FOLFOX6 April 15 - Oct. 1, 2009
Elective sub-total colectomy July 3, 2012 due to 2 DALMs
Currently NED

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Re: The Hazards of Sugar

Postby Guest » Tue Jan 05, 2010 3:58 pm

jmarie wrote:
EBMJ wrote:This whole sugar debate really sucks. It is just one more thing I need to feel guilty about in my diet. In my chemo cycle I have about a 3 day period where everything tastes like cardboard. The only thing that tastes normal and good is sweets. I find myself eating ice cream and milkshakes to make sure I keep my calories up. I really wish there was a definitive answer on this. I think we all deserve some guiltfree pleasures.

Jim


A few ways I have been trying to trick my sweet tooth is sugar free candy or gum, I am addicted to anything cinnamon. I also do carnation milkshakes. Strawberry smoothies with yougurt, frozen strawberries and a little agave nectar do the trick for me. Agave Nectar tastes like honey to me, but is pretty low on the Glycemic index.


Agave nectar is not a healthy substitute for honey or sugar - it's highly processed and very high in fructose. Also, beware of sugar free products - many contain artificial sweeteners such as aspartame that are worse than sugar IMO. I think you need to train your tastebuds not to crave so much sweet food - e.g. substitute nuts for sugary snacks, drink water or vegetable juice instead of juice and carbonated drinks, vegetables and hummus instead of biscuits and cake, natural yoghurt instead of ice cream etc.

I'm curious about the fructose/sucrose discussion. Where does fruit fit in - considering fruit contains fructose?? I have basically tried to cut out processed food altogether - I bake my own bread and make all meals from scratch, most with homegrown fruit and veges. I do eat a lot of fruit though. When I bake, I usually cut sugar quantities and replace with dried fruit (without added sugar or preservatives) or honey. Both honey and dried fruit still contain sugars but at least you get a 'whole' food.


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